bad day for the Mach 1

[69gmachine 15]

Well everything was going just fine when I was heading back to work from my lunchtime workout. For no apparent reason it just cut out and died on me. I coasted off the 4 lane road into someone's driveway and took a look under the hood for anything obviously wrong. I noticed the distributor had moved counterclockwise such that the canister had come to a stop against the AC compressor bracket.

 

This was obviously too retarded to run, so I was hopeful that simply moving it back would get it fired back up again. The smell of gas was pretty strong, so it apparently was running pretty rich, possibly as a result of the bad timing(?). No joy. So now I sit here at work without my car and a rather high degree of anxiety. I can't concentrate on anything. The young man at the house was kind enough to give me a ride back to the base. There's a reason we had Service Stations back then! They checked under the hood every time you filled it up to make sure they stayed reliable.

[Max Power 74]

If an old car breaking down puts you in s state where you can't concentrate on anything, there are less stressful hobbies....LOL.

 

Last week I id my first Toyota timing belt on my Tercel. Get it all back together, and it wont run. What have I done? Had it towed to the dealer and apparently the fuel pump decided to commit suicide as I was doing the timing belt. Turns out I didn't screw anything up at all.

 

It's all good, they are just cars.

[sportsroof69 13]

Does it try to start, or does it just crank? Did the distributor clamp come loose?

[Fordrevhead 29]

reset base timing, change plugs, change oil, start, recheck timing, smile and drive on.

[MikeStang 247]

Well i know i would be in a state of panic if

#1. I had to leave my car on the side of the road at some ones house who i did not know

#2. If my engine that i had spent a vast amount of money on didnt start.

and last but not least it would eat my ass up because i would be so curious as to why it wouldnt start...."Curiosity gets me every time LOL"

And its not a hobby, its an obsession.

Max i remember the first car i did a timing belt on...It was my wifes 93 toyota tercel....car had so many miles on it i actually changed it 3 Times....and each time i could see that none of the belts i tried looked as good as the factory belt did after almost 100k....The next belt i did was on a Twin turbo 300Z ...that was fun

 

Mike

Edited August 3, 2011 by MikeStang

[69gmachine 15]

Well i know i would be in a state of panic if

#1. I had to leave my car on the side of the road at some ones house who i did not know

 

EXACTLY! A block down the road from his house is an apartment complex that's infamous for the drug deals that go down there. The young man who was home helped me push the car up next to the house so it didn't look abandoned or broke down, then he took me up to the main gate at the Navy base so I didn't have far to walk to get back to work. very nice!

 

#2. If my engine that i had spent a vast amount of money on didnt start.

 

Right again! For what I paid I don't expect to have any engine related problems for years.

 

and last but not least it would eat my ass up because i would be so curious as to why it wouldnt start...."Curiosity gets me every time LOL"

And its not a hobby, its an obsession.

 

Yes MikeStang, we think pretty much the same on every aspect of the situation.

 

After work I went back with tools. The man who lived there was home by then and he was super nice. He helped me troubleshoot and we quickly found there was no spark. I pulled the distributor cap off and I could spin the rotor by hand 360 degrees in both directions:sad:. I called AAA and had it towed home. By the time it was in the garage it was 9:30 at night, so I didn't spend any more time on the car, so I don't yet know exactly what failed.

[DRASTiK 22]

What material is/was your dizzy gear and cam?

[Max Power 74]

Max i remember the first car i did a timing belt on...It was my wifes 93 toyota tercel....car had so many miles on it i actually changed it 3 Times....and each time i could see that none of the belts i tried looked as good as the factory belt did after almost 100k....The next belt i did was on a Twin turbo 300Z ...that was fun

 

Mike

 

Yeah, I bought the car with 115k on it and it had the head reworked at 100k. The car has 210k on it now so I thought that running a belt past 120k was risky. Took it out and it looked fine. Given the 100 mile round trip I make every day to work, the 40mpg is addictive. Don't like the car much, but I do like the mileage.

 

Back on track, a spinning dizzy is not good. Worse could happen, but that's not good.

[69gmachine 15]

What material is/was your dizzy gear and cam?

 

 

Steel/Steel.

 

I should mention a couple of things here.

 

1) I supplied the dizzy to the engine builder with the steel gear installed. Without consulting with me he replaced it with a bronze gear. When I saw the steel gear in a box of "leftover parts" he returned, I pulled the dizzy to see what was on it. When I saw the bronze gear I removed it and put the steel gear back on. I intended this engine to last 100,00+ miles, and I've heard many stories of how short the bronze gears last. Perhaps I damaged the roll pin when installing it? There's not a lot that can go wrong insatlling a roll pin though. Either you did or you didn't.

 

2) About 3 to 4 weeks ago my oil pan drain plug came out while driving. I don't know exactly how many miles I drove without oil as I've come to take my car for granted like a normal daily driver and I stopped monitoring the gauges religiously. I need to be more vigilant! Anyway, I bought a replacement drain plug and filled it up with fresh oil and it started right up with no apparant damage done. Since then I've driven maybe a couple of hundred miles. I parked it when it got too hot as my AC is not charged up. Now that the temperature has dropped down to bearable I wanted to drive the car again. Right up until the car died it was running just fine with no sign of any problems. However. I'm wondering if the lack of oil started the gears to start wearing each other down. I'll find out tonight. I didn't want to tell on myself, and if it's the roll pin, I'm going to wish I had just kept this little misadventur to myself ;)

[DRASTiK 22]

If it is the roll pin, then I'll go ahead and say that I've made worse mistakes, so don't feel bad ;-)

 

Dave

[69gmachine 15]

Just pulled the dizzy and the gear and pin look just fine. I started thinking that it must be the timing chain, except for the fact that I was able to spin the rotor either direction with ease. The valvetrain should have prevented that even if there was no timing chain. So I held the gear at the bottom in one hand, and sure enough, I could spin the top either direction with ease. This is a failure mode I've never seen before! The shaft has sheared somewhere internally to the distributor housing. The good news I guess is that it shouldn't take too long or cost too much to get it back on the road. I'll just pop in a dime store '85 dizzy for now and have another autolite core rebuilt this winter. Amazing. Just freakin' amazing!

[Grabber70Mach 107]

Sorry to hear about the issues Larry, hope you get it figured out. Keep us posted on your progress.

[Lemon Owner 11]

Sounds like the shaft seized in the distributor case, it "grabbed" it and twisted it around until the canister hit the ac compressor so the shaft let go. It could be as easy as a new dissy, here's hoping. Good luck.

[69gmachine 15]

Sorry to hear about the issues Larry, hope you get it figured out. Keep us posted on your progress.

 

Thanks Ted, I should have it back on the road soon.

 

Lemon,

 

I believe you're right although I don't know exactly what could have caused it to seize up like that, but there were metal filings that certainly should not have been there. Most likely a small screw came loose and got chewed up and a piece fell down between the shaft and the bushing. Anyway, I probably couldn't have hoped for an easier fix than to simply swap out the dizzy. Now that it's safe in my garage I can take it all in stride.

Edited August 4, 2011 by 69gmachine
more details

[Big Secz 26]

When I first got my Mustang, the first question out of a friend's mouth (who collects/restores Mustangs) was, "Has she left you stranded yet?" I replied, "No, not yet." He replied, "She will, it's just a matter of time. It comes with the territory. Are you a AAA member? If not you need to be."

 

So I soon after called and joined AAA. The best $100/yr investment I have made. My car has been towed on a flatbed four different times.

 

There's a reason why they call these cars a labor of love.

[Max Power 74]

LOL...mine forced me to AAA as well. Oddly, the first time I used it was this weekend for my Toyota daily driver.

[69gmachine 15]

When I first got my Mustang, the first question out of a friend's mouth (who collects/restores Mustangs) was, "Has she left you stranded yet?" I replied, "No, not yet." He replied, "She will, it's just a matter of time. It comes with the territory. Are you a AAA member? If not you need to be."

 

So I soon after called and joined AAA. The best $100/yr investment I have made. My car has been towed on a flatbed four different times.

 

There's a reason why they call these cars a labor of love.

 

Ha Ha, Yep, there should be a "Vintage car owner 101" course where the first thing they teach you is is to join AAA, and the second thing they teach is to expect to need it sooner or later.

 

I first signed up though because my 2000 Dodge Dakota started falling apart (in 2005!) and almost left me stranded 50 miles from home. After I got rid of the Dodge I thought it would be a good thing to keep going for the Mach 1. Glad I did!

 

I've had several close calls with the Mustang but I've always made it home until now. Last year when I took it to Carolina Motorsports Park I had to replace the waterpump before I could drive back home. The host Mustang club there was unbelievably friendly, and offered me rides to the auto parts store and loaned me tools and even covered garage space to work on it. After replacing the waterpump (and starter) I drove back the 500 miles without a hitch.

[coz 108]

You say the dizzy gear looks good? Are you using the stock iron gear with your Hydraulic Roller setup? If so, be careful - the iron gear will tear up this setup and that might be the shavings you see. Comp cams specifically state the replacement of the stock iron gear on the dizzy when running HR. I had to order one from MSD for my setup.

 

http://www.msdignition.com/product.aspx?id=6442451237&terms=iron%20gear%20and%20hydraulic%20roller

Edited August 4, 2011 by coz

[69gmachine 15]

The metal shavings were inside the distributor under the cap. Gear is steel, so I think it's just the distributor that needs to be replaced.

[coz 108]

The metal shavings were inside the distributor under the cap. Gear is steel, so I think it's just the distributor that needs to be replaced.

 

 

Gear is steel? Then yes - replace the dizzy. I saw what an iron gear did to a Hydro Roller setup and would not want that.

[DRASTiK 22]

Out of curiosity, what does the oil pump drive shaft look like? Is it twisted at all?

[69gmachine 15]

I'm not planning to drop the oil pan to be able to see the OP drive shaft, but it's an aftermarket driveshaft that's about a half inch in diameter of hardened steel and necks down into a hex drive at either end, so I'm betting it's OK.

 

However, you make a good point and I will drop in my oil primer and make sure I can get good oil pressure before I put in the replacement dizzy.

[69gmachine 15]

Went to AZone at lunch and ordered the replacement from an '84 Windsor HO truck. The total with taxes was $63 which included a $14 core charge. What a deal! They said they would have it in later today. I'll have to swap the iron gear out for a steel one, but with any luck I'll have it runing again this weekend.

[69gmachine 15]

Went to AZone at lunch and ordered the replacement from an '84 Windsor HO truck. The total with taxes was $63 which included a $14 core charge. What a deal! They said they would have it in later today. I'll have to swap the iron gear out for a steel one, but with any luck I'll have it runing again this weekend.

[DRASTiK 22]

I'd take a quick peek down the dizzy hole while it's open just to be on the safe side, but it sounds like it would be tough to twist that beefy one.

 

Nice price on the new dizzy!