Thoughts/Advice on C4 service vs AOD swap

[TexasEd 188]

I have a 1969 fastback with a 302, C4, and a non-Limited Slip 8" rear.

 

My C4 leaks pretty bad and parts and labor to drop the valve body, inspect and replace the seals is about $175-200.

I can buy an un-rebuilt AOD from an 84 F-150 with 5.0L engine for $200-250 and the labor estimate is about $200-250 to get it installed if I provide all parts.

 

I would like to have the AOD in the long run, but my car needs other things too. I need to make a cost/benefit decision on this and to do that I need to appreciate all the costs associated with the swap.

 

If it is $175-200 for the C4 service where is my cost cutoff point to get the AOD installed instead?

If I could do it for $500 then no-question I would do it but I'm already at that point without any contingencies or extra parts.

 

What are the other factors involved?

- Flex plate balancer?

- Shift lever adapter? (Especially since it is coming off a column shift vehicle)

- swap/modify the axle?

- Put in a LSD 8" or 9" rear differential at the same time?

 

If it gets too much over $750 then I think I wouldn't do it and would put that money towards other items.

 

Other high priority items include:

-rebuild/replace the power assisted steering which leaks worse than the transmission (my garage floor looks like a slaughter house with all the red fluid)

- replace the shocks and springs

 

 

Thanks,

Ed

[TexasEd 188]

I have a 1969 fastback with a 302, C4, and a non-Limited Slip 8" rear.

 

My C4 leaks pretty bad and parts and labor to drop the valve body, inspect and replace the seals is about $175-200.

I can buy an un-rebuilt AOD from an 84 F-150 with 5.0L engine for $200-250 and the labor estimate is about $200-250 to get it installed if I provide all parts.

 

I would like to have the AOD in the long run, but my car needs other things too. I need to make a cost/benefit decision on this and to do that I need to appreciate all the costs associated with the swap.

 

If it is $175-200 for the C4 service where is my cost cutoff point to get the AOD installed instead?

If I could do it for $500 then no-question I would do it but I'm already at that point without any contingencies or extra parts.

 

What are the other factors involved?

- Flex plate balancer?

- Shift lever adapter? (Especially since it is coming off a column shift vehicle)

- swap/modify the axle?

- Put in a LSD 8" or 9" rear differential at the same time?

 

If it gets too much over $750 then I think I wouldn't do it and would put that money towards other items.

 

Other high priority items include:

-rebuild/replace the power assisted steering which leaks worse than the transmission (my garage floor looks like a slaughter house with all the red fluid)

- replace the shocks and springs

 

 

Thanks,

Ed

[LoneWolf2U 136]

:confused1:... Re read your own post.

 

Your budget is 750 and you want to start a mix and match Od trans swap.

That alone if your not doing the work is going to open a money pit.

 

Fix the leaks first, then drop the rest on shocks and springs and drive it.:rockon:

[LoneWolf2U 136]

:confused1:... Re read your own post.

 

Your budget is 750 and you want to start a mix and match Od trans swap.

That alone if your not doing the work is going to open a money pit.

 

Fix the leaks first, then drop the rest on shocks and springs and drive it.:rockon:

[Powershift 19]

Sounds like your best bet is to fix the leaky C4, and address your power steering issues.

 

Yes, an OD trans conversion is well worth the effort. But, it's not a "cheap" conversion, and will require more money than you want to spend right now.

[Powershift 19]

Sounds like your best bet is to fix the leaky C4, and address your power steering issues.

 

Yes, an OD trans conversion is well worth the effort. But, it's not a "cheap" conversion, and will require more money than you want to spend right now.

[TexasEd 188]

How much over the $750 target do you think it would be though? I need to set up a fund to do it sooner or later.

[TexasEd 188]

How much over the $750 target do you think it would be though? I need to set up a fund to do it sooner or later.

[Powershift 19]

Here is a good article to read to answer some of your swap questions.....

 

http://www.mustangmonthly.com/techarticles/mump_0608_ford_transmission_swap/index.html

[Powershift 19]

Here is a good article to read to answer some of your swap questions.....

 

http://www.mustangmonthly.com/techarticles/mump_0608_ford_transmission_swap/index.html

[rwcstang 201]

c-4 love to leak but overall its a good transmission.

 

doing a Conversion costs money unless you farm out the parts and DIY. In any case your going to go over your budget with the things you want to do to your car. replace the seals, and modify the suspension for better handling. also, brakes are a good thing too.

[rwcstang 201]

c-4 love to leak but overall its a good transmission.

 

doing a Conversion costs money unless you farm out the parts and DIY. In any case your going to go over your budget with the things you want to do to your car. replace the seals, and modify the suspension for better handling. also, brakes are a good thing too.

[TexasEd 188]

From that article I need the following (page 2):

 

Transmission $200-250 from above

Cross-member $140

Transmission mount $40

Flexplate $50-75

Throttle valve cable included w/ transmission to $76 for Lokar

AOD Dipstick and tube included w/transmission

Shift linkage adapter $58

Labor $200-250

AOD yoke $95

Shorten & balance the drive shaft $50-100?

 

Adding those up I get between $833 and $1084. In that range I think it is feasible budget wise.

 

Hidden Costs:

Rework exhaust routing?

 

Parts prices looked up here:

http://www.transmissioncenter.org/classic_mustang_to_aod_conversion.htm

 

 

What am I missing?

Edited February 20, 2012 by TexasEd

[TexasEd 188]

From that article I need the following (page 2):

 

Transmission $200-250 from above

Cross-member $140

Transmission mount $40

Flexplate $50-75

Throttle valve cable included w/ transmission to $76 for Lokar

AOD Dipstick and tube included w/transmission

Shift linkage adapter $58

Labor $200-250

AOD yoke $95

Shorten & balance the drive shaft $50-100?

 

Adding those up I get between $833 and $1084. In that range I think it is feasible budget wise.

 

Hidden Costs:

Rework exhaust routing?

 

Parts prices looked up here:

http://www.transmissioncenter.org/classic_mustang_to_aod_conversion.htm

 

 

What am I missing?

Edited February 20, 2012 by TexasEd

[sportsroof69 13]

You may need new headers with an AOD as well, because the bellhousing is really wide.

[sportsroof69 13]

You may need new headers with an AOD as well, because the bellhousing is really wide.

[LindenBruce 27]

From that article I need the following (page 2):

 

Transmission $200-250 from above

Cross-member $140

Transmission mount $40

Flexplate $50-75

Throttle valve cable included w/ transmission to $76 for Lokar

AOD Dipstick and tube included w/transmission

Shift linkage adapter $58

Labor $200-250

AOD yoke $95

Shorten & balance the drive shaft $50-100?

 

Adding those up I get between $833 and $1084. In that range I think it is feasible budget wise.

Hidden Costs:

Rework exhaust routing?

Parts prices looked up here:

http://www.transmissioncenter.org/classic_mustang_to_aod_conversion.htm

What am I missing?

 

 

Texas Ed,

 

You aren't going to need half the parts in that article.

 

Your crossmember should work just fine. You may have to elongate the mounting slots. Transmission mount is the same.

 

Your existing flywheel/harmonic damper will work just fine. Maintain your engine's balancing parts. The AOD does not care, but your engine does.

 

You will need to buy some parts for the TV cable. You can go with the Lokar stuff, which I don't care for, or use factory brackets and cable and make your own TV system. You will need to get the TV/Throttle stud adapter for your carburetor.

 

As long as you use a case fill dipstick tube for any small block ford automatic transmission, it will work for your AOD. So just use your C4 tube assembly. Full is at the top pf the oil pan rail on an AOD.

 

You will need to flip the shift lever on the AOD 180 degrees to work with a floor shifter or buy the replacement shift lever. And you will need to modify your shift lever rod or buy the adjustable unit.

 

Your 28 spline C4 yoke should work on the AOD. As long as you currently have a 28 spline yoke.

 

So that saves you about $300.00 dollars. Now fix your leaky PS system!!!:tt2: I hate leaks.

 

I have some pics of the TV fabing that I did if you want them. Bruce

[LindenBruce 27]

From that article I need the following (page 2):

 

Transmission $200-250 from above

Cross-member $140

Transmission mount $40

Flexplate $50-75

Throttle valve cable included w/ transmission to $76 for Lokar

AOD Dipstick and tube included w/transmission

Shift linkage adapter $58

Labor $200-250

AOD yoke $95

Shorten & balance the drive shaft $50-100?

 

Adding those up I get between $833 and $1084. In that range I think it is feasible budget wise.

Hidden Costs:

Rework exhaust routing?

Parts prices looked up here:

http://www.transmissioncenter.org/classic_mustang_to_aod_conversion.htm

What am I missing?

 

 

Texas Ed,

 

You aren't going to need half the parts in that article.

 

Your crossmember should work just fine. You may have to elongate the mounting slots. Transmission mount is the same.

 

Your existing flywheel/harmonic damper will work just fine. Maintain your engine's balancing parts. The AOD does not care, but your engine does.

 

You will need to buy some parts for the TV cable. You can go with the Lokar stuff, which I don't care for, or use factory brackets and cable and make your own TV system. You will need to get the TV/Throttle stud adapter for your carburetor.

 

As long as you use a case fill dipstick tube for any small block ford automatic transmission, it will work for your AOD. So just use your C4 tube assembly. Full is at the top pf the oil pan rail on an AOD.

 

You will need to flip the shift lever on the AOD 180 degrees to work with a floor shifter or buy the replacement shift lever. And you will need to modify your shift lever rod or buy the adjustable unit.

 

Your 28 spline C4 yoke should work on the AOD. As long as you currently have a 28 spline yoke.

 

So that saves you about $300.00 dollars. Now fix your leaky PS system!!!:tt2: I hate leaks.

 

I have some pics of the TV fabing that I did if you want them. Bruce

[TexasEd 188]

Thanks, LindenBruce.

 

That was the information I was looking for.

 

I think I'm going to go with the fix to the existing transmission now anyway, but I have a good idea of what I'll need in a swap.

 

I have a good independent transmission guy that I can rely on for a rebuild he just hasn't done a C4 to AOD swap before but he was telling me about figuring out how to adjust the TV and about shortening the axle off the top of his head. I think he is interested in it from a point of professional curiosity. I might have him keep an eye out for a good AOD that was in a floor shifting car.

 

Long term I want to swap out the entire drive train, I'm just trying to figure out if it made sense to do some of it incrementally, especially since the AOD has the potential to save gas and make highway driving nicer.

 

I'm getting ~$2000 in a hail damage claim to my pickup truck that I'll be putting into the Mustang so I should be able to make enough progress to get it roadworthy with that.

Edited February 21, 2012 by TexasEd

[TexasEd 188]

Thanks, LindenBruce.

 

That was the information I was looking for.

 

I think I'm going to go with the fix to the existing transmission now anyway, but I have a good idea of what I'll need in a swap.

 

I have a good independent transmission guy that I can rely on for a rebuild he just hasn't done a C4 to AOD swap before but he was telling me about figuring out how to adjust the TV and about shortening the axle off the top of his head. I think he is interested in it from a point of professional curiosity. I might have him keep an eye out for a good AOD that was in a floor shifting car.

 

Long term I want to swap out the entire drive train, I'm just trying to figure out if it made sense to do some of it incrementally, especially since the AOD has the potential to save gas and make highway driving nicer.

 

I'm getting ~$2000 in a hail damage claim to my pickup truck that I'll be putting into the Mustang so I should be able to make enough progress to get it roadworthy with that.

Edited February 21, 2012 by TexasEd

[danno 128]

LindenBruce summed it up. If you are going to do some of the work yourself, you can also save money other ways.

1. I made my crossmember in about 2 hours from scrap sitting around the garage. They are easy to do.

2. You should not need to shorten the driveshaft if you get the yoke from the car with the AOD. I understand some cars had different yokes, so look into which is best to work with a 69 driveshaft.

3. One thing not mentioned is the electrical connection for backup lite in reverse and started interlock in neutral and park. Again, easy to make if you get the cable from the donor aod car.

 

So keep watching and accumulate the parts over time, and make the swap sometime later.

[danno 128]

LindenBruce summed it up. If you are going to do some of the work yourself, you can also save money other ways.

1. I made my crossmember in about 2 hours from scrap sitting around the garage. They are easy to do.

2. You should not need to shorten the driveshaft if you get the yoke from the car with the AOD. I understand some cars had different yokes, so look into which is best to work with a 69 driveshaft.

3. One thing not mentioned is the electrical connection for backup lite in reverse and started interlock in neutral and park. Again, easy to make if you get the cable from the donor aod car.

 

So keep watching and accumulate the parts over time, and make the swap sometime later.

[LindenBruce 27]

Righto Danno. I forgot to mention the park neutral switch thing. The 69's use a four wire setup as does the AOD. I saw recently one of the popular Mustang parts vendors has new pigtails for the AOD switch and a diagram on how to wire it to the 69's existing wiring.

 

Also, there are two different output shaft lengths for the AOD. The long shaft transmissions were in full size cars like Crown Vics and Town cars and the short shafters were in compacts like Mustangs. There is only like an inch difference in reality. Bruce

[LindenBruce 27]

Righto Danno. I forgot to mention the park neutral switch thing. The 69's use a four wire setup as does the AOD. I saw recently one of the popular Mustang parts vendors has new pigtails for the AOD switch and a diagram on how to wire it to the 69's existing wiring.

 

Also, there are two different output shaft lengths for the AOD. The long shaft transmissions were in full size cars like Crown Vics and Town cars and the short shafters were in compacts like Mustangs. There is only like an inch difference in reality. Bruce