Group Wisdom wanted on non-technical issue

[Angel 24]

When I receive something from a vendor, I notice two things. One, I open the box immediately after receiving it and I inspect the part. Two, the part is always overly wrapped in bubble wrap, paper, air bags, etc. Tom, you should have inspected the part upon receiving it, the delay is working against your claim. Bnickel, I know you probably don't ship many things but I"m sure you've ordered stuff from vendors and consequently you have seen how they package items, so you should have had something to reference to. Now, we can argue both sides of this but ultimately I think UPS is at fault. Argue your case and speak to upper management, if they cant help, speak to the person above them. $300 is nothing to a big company so just keep at it and they'll probably give in.

 

That being said, if all else fails, settle at 50/50. I think its safe to say that most of the people on this forum are a reflection of ourselves. We are all similar people brought together by the love for our cars. We earn our money the same way we earn our cars, through hard work. Bnickel, you sold the part to someone just like you. Tom, you bought the part from someone just like you. I wouldn't rip myself off. But that's just my 2 cents.

[foothilltom 33]

Gang, I think I'd like to put this to bed now. I'm actually very glad I solicited feedback as it opened my eyes on a few things -- especially my leaving the box in my house for 3 weeks while on vacation.

 

I also think this little situation might help others in the future.

 

Finally, I don't think there was a bit of "mud" or a single "vulgarity" slung here (perhaps I misunderstood B-Man's point) which was my intention from the start. I don't hold anything against BNickel. He's an honorable dude. I'd like to think I'm the same.

 

Thanks for all your thoughts. BNickel, I'm sure it's obvious by now, but let's settle this up 50-50 as you suggested originally. If by some miracle UPS comes through, please let me know.

 

Thanks again.

Tom

[Fordrevhead 29]

a smidgeon off base but I'll just chime in with an fyi that ups has strict packing requirements on classes of items, electronics for example, and if they aren't followed and they want to inspect the shipment they can and will deny claim insurance or not.

 

I followed them to a T when I shipped an antique Fender Tube guitar amplifier that I sold on ebay. They are a pita to find on their site (of course... because this reduces claim payouts) but anyway, it was something like 3" thick of bubble wrap everywhere then a tight fitting cardboard box, then 4 inches of peanuts then another box. This thing could have flown out the back of the ups truck on I91 and been fine.

Edited November 25, 2009 by Fordrevhead

[B-Man 11]

foothilltom

misunderstood. I was commending the way things were being handled by both of you and still am.

[foothilltom 33]

Ah, my bad. That's very kind of you to say. There are no hard feelings here either. I am content with the wisdom of the group.

 

Tom

[mikem 13]

Hit up PayPal before you put this to bed. Regardless of fault, you both handled this like honorable gentlemen. Kudos.

[bnickel 10,004]

Gang, I think I'd like to put this to bed now. I'm actually very glad I solicited feedback as it opened my eyes on a few things -- especially my leaving the box in my house for 3 weeks while on vacation.

 

I also think this little situation might help others in the future.

 

Finally, I don't think there was a bit of "mud" or a single "vulgarity" slung here (perhaps I misunderstood B-Man's point) which was my intention from the start. I don't hold anything against BNickel. He's an honorable dude. I'd like to think I'm the same.

 

Thanks for all your thoughts. BNickel, I'm sure it's obvious by now, but let's settle this up 50-50 as you suggested originally. If by some miracle UPS comes through, please let me know.

 

Thanks again.

Tom

 

 

hey Tom, thanks for helping me out on this, i'm gonna stay on UPS though and see if i can't all of your money back for you!!!!! i appreciate you meeting me half way for sure and i'll also keep looking for a decent base between now and then as well. Thanks!!!!!

[LSG 15]

B-5, I used to drive a truck and work the shipping desk at an electrical supply wharehouse.....and I can tell you UPS beats the s--t out of everything. One of their drivers was explaining to me how ALL of their packages have to endure a 4 ft drop, something about the way their machinery sorts and moves the packages.....I not at all certain the general public knows each and every package they deliver has to go through this treatment. I'm betting that the console survived and that some heavy stuff landed or was piled on top of it. More than one time we got stuff that had been repackaged by UPS- these were almost always because UPS had destroyed the original pacaging. There were lots of things we refused if it came on a UPS truck, we KNEW it was going to be broken. Light bulbs we refused, steel fittings, we accepted. We put some pressure on them by having a big 'pile of shame' that was visible to all of our customers- an 8ft by 8ft by 4 or 5 feet tall pile of stuff that had come in broken from UPS. We always told our customers that we couldn't recommend UPS, and told our suppliers to use someone else, or we'll buy from someone who will. FedEx was no better. We had to chase after their drivers as they would dump stuff at our door and then try and get away quickly. Keep after UPS. Tell them you're the Mod here and we ship thousands of packages to each other every week, and they really shouldn't poke the bear here. Keep calling your way up their command chain. make a you tube video that shows how fubar-ed the console is. Publicly make a spectacle of them. Thats what they fear most. Make it your new life's goal to embarrass UPS. If you create enough problems for them, they'll consider themselves lucky to be able to give you Tom's 300$. Don't give up, that's what UPS wants. I mean what is insurance for, anyways ? You are dealing with evil, we're all behind you both here. LSG

[SELLERSRODSHOP 13]

i can say with much experience that the insurance is only good for a package that gets lost. they always find some kind of excuse why the claim won't be honored. much of my motorcycle work is across the country where customers ship me the sheetmetal for restoration & i return ship after completion. after a couple similar issues, i just have a standing agreement with the customer that if a part is damaged, return to me that part only & i repair & reship at my expense. much easier on me that way. the first claim that was filed , their inspectors damged the rest of the parts & i ended up redoing the whole job at my dime after the claim was denied. ups denied because i couldn't produce a reciept showing what the parts were worth (1948 harley davidson) they said just because i insured for $500, that didn't mean the parts were worth that amount...

 

on a second note, if all of the pieces are there to the busted console, i might be interested in purchasing it as a test piece for a new plastic repair proceedure i'm working on... might help defray some of the costs between the two parties...

[Machspeed 219]

What an incredibly refreshing and educational post this has been!!! Let me say, after reading this, I see two very honorable men. Moreover, I'd purchase, without reservation, from either of you.

[Sidthing 10]

I spent roughly two years doing the shipping and receiving for a NOS Ford parts business, and had to learn the hard way about UPS, it was a complete dash assembly for a 90's Lincoln that went out the door for $1000. It was crushed by UPS and the company I worked for had to eat every cent. Luckily I wasn't fired. I was given thorough instruction for packaging for UPS. You have to assume it will be crushed in on every side. Cutting wood strips to run end to end, and top to bottom, and like what was said earlier 6 inches in all directions. When receiving a package you must open it before the driver leaves. I believe in the small writing it specifically states the inspection in front of the driver. Trim pieces were shrink wrapped to wood strips and shipped in pvc tubes. They loved being able to tell me when they had a rare piece that it's the only one in the parts locating system, and shipping glass made me sweat bullets.

Happy shipping guys, and we can all learn that our desire for overkill isn't wasted when it comes to packaging.

[Pakrat 1,043]

Wow, I really missed a lot in the many months that I have been away. I came close a few times to buying this console from B over the years and this could have easily been me in the predicament, that's the only reason I am chiming in late here. In the end I think the best thing on any transaction is where both parties can walk away feeling satisified and it sounds like though neither will be thrilled, an equitable split is the fair thing.

 

That being said, I think the item required much better packaging. Even a brand new hollow plastic item like this would be entombed in a styrofoam mold twice it's size as if it were made of candy glass much less super brittle 40 year old plastic. With the after math of xmas behind me I can say that have a garage now full of cardboard and styrofoam that is 5 times greater than the pile of new toys my daughter has and most of these are not fragile items at all. When I order even a shop manual from a vendor it seems to come in a package large enough for a transmission and has about 3 weeks worth of daily newspapers surrounding it. I usually feel a little mad at this like they are sticking me with their trash that I now have to throw away but they do it for a greater reason obviously and I should be more thankful that items arrived safely instead, after all this I certainly will.

 

I never buy insurance only because I can't be bothered to read thru all the fine print and refuse to sign something without doing so. Id rather take the owness on me to secure it's safety. I don't know how much extra the insurance costs but it's always money better spent on packaging even if it makes it more exepnsive to ship for weight or size. There is reason also that they make dozen's of shipping labels with warnings like Fragile, Do Not Bend, Do Not Stack, This Side Up etc... In this case the package did not look mishandled though simply the trama of what normally happens in shipping, conveyor belts, small drops, tossing onto the truck, etc.... You simply can not ever safeguard something too much that you are shipping even if it is made of adamantium.

 

[zach69grande 25]

As the manager of a distribution facility for hospital supplies i've been on that end of the UPS chain MANY times. They're brutal, and the claim process is miserable - stick it out they will cave. it's easier in my position because i can say "well up yours, i'll switch all my business to Fed EX"

keep calling, keep working your way up the claims department chain.

If your shipping container has the strength stamp on the outside make sure you document and share them, as well any packing material you did use. They abuse packages. at any point in time anyone could have packaged something *better* but explain that you were (and their customers) not aware of how their system works, how much impact it must withstand etc..

Usually it takes about 4 tries and i convince them that they failed me as a customer and my check will show up.. like i said, i'm a business so i have some different leverage.. keep trying - at least you two behaved like adults. Cheers to both of you

 

At least some people have learned something they may have never thought about