Need help - where does this go?

[astoria18 10]

Hello,

Like I'm sure many other people do, I'm going to introduce myself with a dilemma. I'm 19 and recently purchaced a 1970 Mustang coupe with a 302 2bbl and automatic transmission. The engine runs, after a little effort. I always have to rev the engine while cranking in order to get it to idle. It won't drive in reverse up any kind of an incline without stalling, and it chooses to stall at other random times as well. I'm new to Mustangs and to Ford for that matter, having owned two thirdgen F-body cars.

 

I checked all of the vacuum hose routing.. all seems good. While poking around, I found this wire was not connected to anything and I have no idea where it is supposed to be. It comes from a 3 wire harness, one which goes to the ignition coil, another that goes to something that I can't name (but I took a picture of it) and the third is just hanging there. While it might not be the cause of my problem, I'd imagine it's important nonetheless. Any light that anyone can shed on this subject for me would be greatly appreciated.

 

Thanks!

 

[Protowrxs 111]

Looks like the temperature sending unit doesn't have a connection. That is the item in the middle pic. I would assume your temp gauge doesn't register anything as it sits.

 

EDIT: Oh.. and welcome to the site!

 

-Stephen

[astoria18 10]

I didn't even notice that was there. Thanks!

[351carlo 10]

Welcome!

 

Most definitely the wire to you temp sending unit as pointed out. Clearly shown on the second picture in the middle with the stud coming out! Those are the wonderful ford push on connectors, and they do make life easier if they are in good condition.

 

Good luck, and feel free to post any question, no matter how big or small. We've all been there at one point, none of us were born with infinite car knowledge... although some of us might like to think so :tongue:

[dawtips 10]

I have that same wire sitting in my engine and wasn't sure what it was either. But I have an aftermarket thermometer below my dash, so I guess I don't need it.

[Pakrat 1,043]

Welcome!

 

While it is good for you to fix that I hope you haven't gotten the impression that this is what makes your car stall because it's not. First off, are you priming the car before trying to start? Since you are new to this hobby I am going to be very basic in the following info so please don't think I am talking to you like you are stupid if you know some of this as I have no idea what you do and don't know about 60's technology (for lack of a better term).

 

With a carb car it is never as easy to start as a modern fuel injection. Many things can be aiding in these problems you have and the cars mechanicals do look a bit in need of your TLC. When starting your car cold you need to prime it, all cars are different and too much will flood it so you need to try a few things to see what works best. My car for example requires one full pedal press and release and then held back down in half way and it will usually start up on the first crank except after long storage, then 2 pumps is usually what it takes. For a hot start usually just holding it in half way is usually enough, no extra pumping. If you do not succesfully start your car always wait about 30 seconds to try again or you will eventually fry your starter.

 

Even a freshly rebuilt car may require that you play with the pedal a little bit for the first 10 seconds or so until it warms up and is ready to idle smooth and drive. If your choke is not working properly it can make idleing tough also. My car again for example has the choke disconnected because I only drive in the summer and it just starts smoother without it. Your fuel filter could also be dirty and this will give you random performance and could casue issues like stalling in reverse up a hill. Depending on how often the car was used prior to you buying it the whole fuel system could probably use a flushing in fact. Any car that has sat for more than a few months without fuel stabalizer added to the gas will casue varnish and gum everything up.

 

If you are running points and a condensor still then they may be warn also and out of gap. If they look scorched then you could file and re-gap them but it's probably best to replace them and if you do then always replace the condensor too, these are cheap parts and should always be treated as a unit. Better still lose them completely and invest in a pertronix kit or simillar, same old school look with a way better electronic ignition. I wouldn't be surprised if you spark plugs aren't great either and could use either a good cleaning and regapping along with some wires.

 

Finally your timing. At the factory these cars were set at 6* BTDC and this enemic to say the least. It will probably benefit from some advancing. You can set it up woth a timing light to check where you are at and where to set it but I am of the school that timing by ear is the best way. Advance it until it pings then back it off a little and that should be the timing your car like best. You'll probably end up somewhere around 10 - 13* BTDC.

 

This basic tune up can work wonders and is really part of every old car owners routine no matter how newly rebuilt there car is, that is just part of the hobby and you'll have to get used to that. Your car can purr like a kitten one day and just go click click the next for no apparant reason. There are all kinds of gremlins in the ground wires and you will be trouble shooting many things down the road so start squirelling away some play money and be prepared to eventually replace almost every mechanical part until you end up right back where you started many years from now.

 

Whew, I didn't plan on writing a book but a few basics later here we are.

Oh yeah, buy yourself a Ford manual, you will need it!!!!!!

 

Pak.

[astoria18 10]

Pak, thanks a lot, I really appreciated the detailed response. Although some of it was things I know, much of it was either new or a good refresher as my only experience with a carb car was my dad's old truck. I've been priming the car, and I replaced the fuel filter this morning and plan on going over the spark plugs, wires, cap, and rotor tomorrow, so it seems like I'm on the right track. I didn't consider timing, so I'll play with that as well. I really had no idea what that wire is, but once I realized it's for the gauges, I realized that it couldnt be my problem that I'm looking for.

 

Thanks for all of the replies!

[Pakrat 1,043]

No problem, that's what we are here for and we all love to encourage young enthusiasts to the hobby. You are the blood that will keep this hobby alive long after we are all gone. Be sure to let us know how you make out after the tune up and never think a question is a dumb one, if you aren't sure, ask.

 

I can't wait until you get to the next step which is waking up that 302 with a nice stealth intake and a 4V carb with an rumbly CAM and some nice headers!!!!!!:whistling:

[351carlo 10]

Phew Pak.... Good response! :clap:

 

I just completely overlooked the stall portion of the post... serves me right for not reading.

 

Just as Pak said, I'm glad to see another young guy joinging the group. I too am 19 with a 70 Coupe, and it's VERY rewarding to work on your own car and really have something you can point to and say, ''I built that.''

 

As a warning, our age group is a lot different than our parents generation. Most kids our age won't understand why we have an old car, and will assume their Honda will outrun you any day. Oh and the girls don't always like true muscle as much as they like neon lights and big aluminum wings.... :blink:

[astoria18 10]

Like I said, I was a GM guy until I met my girlfriend. Her dream car is a C2 Stingray, followed very closely by a first generation Mustang. She not only loves classic muscle, but she has been helping out where she can when I'm working on it.

 

Its weird how many of my friends parents have commented on the car. My friends like it too, but their parents always have some kind of an old Mustang story to tell. It's pretty cool.

 

After my third gen Camaro and Trans Am, I decided to get something more economical and bought a Prelude. It took all of a month for it to bore me. I guess I'll never understand that world like they won't understand ours.

[Pakrat 1,043]

Phew Pak.... Good response! :clap:

 

Heh heh, he's just darn lucky there was nothing good on TV last night, lol.

[astoria18 10]

Does the fact that the engine simply won't catch unless the accelerator is pressed help to pimpoint where I should begin looking?

[351carlo 10]

Is it when you depress it and hold it, or pedal it? Sounds to me like a slight vacuum leak. It really is ashame you live so far away, I'd love to lend a hand.

 

Vintage mustangs are great. And she sounds like my kinda girl with a C2 as her first pick and a Mustang as her second :tongue: It's alright I'm just kidding since I have my own who thoroughly enjoys my car... even if she does think I might like it a little more than her. I can't deny I spend more money on it :ph34r:

 

I have a Honda too. It gets me from point a to point b with the least amount of gas being used, while staying cool and listening to music on my CD player. When I want to drive for the thrill of driving, I go home and get my other car. Of course when I'm out in my Accord the Honda guys don't realize when I tell them that I'll race them in my car for 100 bucks that I'm not talking about the Accord :whistling: You should see their faces when a solid cammed high compression nitrous motor 70 Mustang comes back in 15 minutes. Normally they see the Hoosiers and hear the cutouts open and drive away.

[astoria18 10]

I have to hold down the pedal as soon as the engine even seems like it might catch. Once I've got it started, though, it'll idle just fine, albeit a little rough. I suspected the vacuum lines as well, but I checked all of them yesterday.. there's something goofy going on toward the rear of the engine (I'll take a picture in the morning, it certainly didn't come from the factory this way) but I didn't see anywhere where there might be a leak. All of the hoses seem relatively new and they all flex without cracking or feeling mushy. There might still be a leak somewhere, but I didn't see anything to lead me to believe that the vacuum lines were a problem, which was kind of a let down. I was hoping it would be that simple.

 

The car is slowly taking over the 'most expensive' honors from my girlfriend, but it's not there yet. The best part is I don't think she'll really mind, she's absolutely in love with the stang.

[churchkey 13]

Easy way to check for a vacuum leak. While the motor is at idle spray WD40 or carb cleaner at all the vacuum lines, carb to intake gasket, manifold to head gaskets. If there is a bad gasket or leak the motor will smooth out for a few seconds.

 

Also pinch off each vacuum line one at a time. If the motor smooths out whatever that vacuum line is operating may be bad.

 

You state it has limited power. I think you may have a timing chain that needs attention.

 

The very best way to track down a problem such as yours.is to start with the basics. If you were to bring your car to my shop the first thing I would do is take a compression test. This will let you know if you have a weak cylinder or the cam is out of time due to a bad timing chain. Compression on all cylinders around 60 to 80#'s indicates a bad chain.

 

Test all the plug wires & coil wire with a ohm meter or just replace them.

[Cheo69GT 1]

I have to hold down the pedal as soon as the engine even seems like it might catch. Once I've got it started, though, it'll idle just fine, albeit a little rough. I suspected the vacuum lines as well, but I checked all of them yesterday.. there's something goofy going on toward the rear of the engine (I'll take a picture in the morning, it certainly didn't come from the factory this way) but I didn't see anywhere where there might be a leak. All of the hoses seem relatively new and they all flex without cracking or feeling mushy. There might still be a leak somewhere, but I didn't see anything to lead me to believe that the vacuum lines were a problem, which was kind of a let down. I was hoping it would be that simple.

 

The car is slowly taking over the 'most expensive' honors from my girlfriend, but it's not there yet. The best part is I don't think she'll really mind, she's absolutely in love with the stang.

 

You've covered most everything, BTW, welcome to the forum! To me, it sounds like a timing issues...

[GreaseMonkey 102]

Just as Pak said, I'm glad to see another young guy joinging the group. I too am 19 with a 70 Coupe, and it's VERY rewarding to work on your own car and really have something you can point to and say, ''I built that.''

 

yeah it is, i am 19 as well except i have a 69 coupe. welcome to the site astoria18!

 

i dont think many of my freinds understand the hobby part of owning a classic car, most of them seem to think i just got it because of the coolness factor. well, that WAS a big part of it, but i also got it because i love working on things like this. another thing was because the first car i ever drove, a driving school toyota camry, bored the crap out of me in about 10 mins. that was when i knew i just had to have an older car.