jag 10 Report post Posted June 11, 2009 The car was running fine. I turned it off to go into a store came back out and there is no starter or interior courtesy lights. I put the key on and jumped from the battery to the start post on the solenoid. The car started and I drove home. I turned off the car again and tried to start it, it started. Turned it off again and it was dead again. I think the key is when it is dead there are no courtesy lights. It sounds like a blown fuse but I can't seem to find one. Has anyone run into this? JAG Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Justafordguy 10 Report post Posted June 12, 2009 I don't think the starter circuit has a fuse. It sounds like a grounding problem to me. Better check the body ground wire. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jag 10 Report post Posted June 12, 2009 The engine ground is new and fine. If the gound was gone I don't think I could jump arounf the key start switch and start the car. After thinking iabout it, it can't be a fuse either since it started once normally after the initial failure. Do the courtesy lights run through the key switch circuits? I am wondering if the original switch may be starting to become intermittant. JAG Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dennyb68 11 Report post Posted June 12, 2009 I would say it's the switch Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jurisd 10 Report post Posted June 12, 2009 I think the key is when it is dead there are no courtesy lights. It sounds like a blown fuse but I can't seem to find one. Has anyone run into this? JAG I had that issue on an old Buick. Do you still have power to anything when this happens, or is it dead and dark? Did your courtesy lights blink on when you hooked up the jumpstart? If so (as elementary as this sounds) pull your battery cables off, and scrub off the oxidation on both the terminals and battery posts. Since you could jump it even with the issue happening, I would bet you've just got a weak battery connection, even if you haven't messed with the battery terminals. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jag 10 Report post Posted June 12, 2009 I probably was unclear. The battery is fine. It starts when I put a jumper wire from the battery side of the started solenid in the engine compartment to the start terminal on that same solenoid. The battery connections are clean. JAG Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Justafordguy 10 Report post Posted June 12, 2009 It does sound like the switch but I don't think the interior lights go through the switch. I thing they come from the fuse box. I think they are on a relay also. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
S code 69 13 Report post Posted June 12, 2009 Are your interior lights the only thing that goes dead when it won't start ? what about your headlights and radio ect ? do you have the ground strap from the block to the body in place and tight? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Pakrat 1,043 Report post Posted June 12, 2009 By what you are clarifying in your second post it sounds to me like it just may be the solenoid itself since you can jump it from the outside but not on it's own internals. Jumping it once may have made the contact connect again the one time, kinda like you can shake a burnt light bulb and get it to temporarily work again if the burnt filaments touch. Easy and cheap enough to swap and see if you don't want to start checking each connection with a multi meter or just don't have access to one. Also, just as a rule of thumb remember that new does not always equal good, defects happen all the time especially on repro parts and they all need to be verified when troubleshooting. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jag 10 Report post Posted June 13, 2009 Clarification is always good. I can start the car every time by shorting the plus side of the battery to the start terminal of the starting motor relay as it is called on the wiring diagram. I plan to do voltage checks tomorrow. Has anyone ever run across a "Dash panel disconnect"? I brought this up because according to the wiring diagram, power for the headlights comes through this before it gets to the head light switch. Oh isn't this fun! I'd rather be driving.... JAG JAG Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jag 10 Report post Posted June 13, 2009 The problem is solved!! After taking a cue from S Code 69 I looked for the common point of the headlights and the starter in the wiring diagram. The power feed for both circuits, electrically, is the same and comes from the battery side of the starter solenoid relay. I felt under there and the wire had broken off at the wire connector. The car starts great again. Thank you for everyones help in solving this problem. JAG Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jag 10 Report post Posted June 15, 2009 After taking a suggestion fron S Code 69 regarding head lights I started to look for a common electrical feed for both the starter and head lights. Both these systems are feed from the same electrical wire according to the electrical wiring diagram. This feed comes from the starter solenoid relay. I felt underneath the stud where the solenoid relay hooks to the battery and I found the main 12 volt feed wire had broken off at the connector. A new connector was installed and it works great. Thank for all who helped me think about different alternatives. You made my trouble shooting much quicker. JAG Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
