393 Stoker with 351 D0OE heads?

[Burn 14]

I have a stock 1971 D1AE 351w motor with D0OE heads and need some advice on a build. I’m looking for a budget build and 400 street able HP.

 

1.)How much TQ & HP can be made with 393 stroker (3.850 crank, stock 351 rods, 302 pistons) Weiand Stealth intake and CompCams XE274H Cam, 600cfm carb, long tube headers, 351 D0OE Heads (reconditioned but stock), 10.5:1cr?

 

2.) Same setup as above but with the stock crank (M=.020 & R=.020 undersize) and .030 over 351w Hyper. Pistons .030 over. How much TQ and Hp would this setup produce?

 

I'm shooting for 400HP...Is this even possible with the stock heads and crankshaft with no port or polish work?

 

I'll eventually buy some ARF 165's or Trick Flow Twisted Wedge Aluminum heads when I have more $$$.

 

Thanks!

[bnickel 10,004]

with eitherr combo you're going to need more than that 600 holley, more like a 750. 400hp with stock unported D0OE heads is going to be almost impossible even with a 393 stroker crank. i say either port the heads and do the stroker now and add the AFR's later or get the AFR's now and stroke the motor later. you're going to get a little bit more power with the stroker and unported heads but the heads are going to choke the shit of a stroker, stock unported SBF heads are barely adequate for a stock motor much less a stroker.

[Max Power 74]

Any aftermarket head will be better than stockers. 10.5:1 will be ping prone with iron heads as well, so you will lose HP by running a conservative curve. The heads are more important than the cubes, so get decent heads and a 750cfm carb.

 

HP is a balance package. You can't have a restriction like those heads and expect 400hp.

[coz 108]

I'm a firm believer in the bottom end being the core of a build and the starting point. If it's your desire to go to a 393 stroker you have to do a bore and stroke to achieve this. To stay somewhat in budget, have head work done on the iron heads - it's really not that much. And don't let anyone tell you iron heads can't cut it. I kept mine mainly because of their strength and they can handle near 600HP. Also I run 10:7 CR and 93 octane and never ping - under load or at WOT. The real question is how many times do you want to pull the engine? Complete the bottom end once and do it right and then work from there. I also agree - look into a 750cfm or even a 670 SE - they flow real nice....

[Burn 14]

I don’t want to be pulling that motor again so I'll go with the 393 Stroker and change the carb to 750cfm. I'm sure there are threads after threads of Holley vs Edelbrock. What carb do you all use and why?

 

I really don’t want to do any work at all to these heads because I believe its money well wasted. Porting them will give me the 400HP but what if I decided that’s just not enough power??? Then I'll have to go out and buy the aluminum ones anyway.

 

Let’s say I go ahead and put the unported D0OE heads on this stroker motor. I know this will "Choke it" and that's not a good thing, but does that just mean the motor won’t make its optimum power, or does this mean it could cause internal engine harm/ware?

[bnickel 10,004]

actually those heads have 1.84/1.54 valves. the engine will not make anywhere near the HP it could with either ported heads or the AFR's. my opinion is that doing a strker kit with stock unported heads is a big waste of money, you'll make the same power or more with a basically stock rebuild on the bottom end with hypereutectic pistons and good heads as you would with a high dollar stroker kit and stock heads, and have less problems doing it

[coz 108]

actually those heads have 1.84/1.54 valves. the engine will not make anywhere near the HP it could with either ported heads or the AFR's. my opinion is that doing a strker kit with stock unported heads is a big waste of money, you'll make the same power or more with a basically stock rebuild on the bottom end with hypereutectic pistons and good heads as you would with a high dollar stroker kit and stock heads, and have less problems doing it

 

 

Yep - would agree. If you go stroker do the heads. Sorry didn't look up the stock head info but instead compared them to mine (not in size but iron). I would wait until the cash is there and do the stroker and heads at the same time. Look into the AFR 185's or maybe CHI and turn the engine into a Clevor. Now you can begin to make some real power. But as I stated and you agreed, you only want to pull the engine once. If that holds true you should also think roller rocker .v. tappet, hydraulics, etc.... Of course that means $$$$$ Good rule of thumb - what ever your budget add 50 to 100 % to the number....

[Burn 14]

Engine kits.com sells the 393 stroker cast nodular crank for $189 and the hyper speedpro pistons for $100 (I can use my stock rods) Wouldn’t anyone consider go this route than spend the same money on a stock crank and pistons? The price is the only reason I was considering a 393 other than going back with stock. But, if the 393 stroker isn't needed for 400hp then I might just stick with the stock crank and heads and then later upgrade the heads to AFR 165 or 185's to get my 400hp. Will the 351w stock rebuilt bottom end withstand 400-500hp though?

[bnickel 10,004]

a stock windsor bottom end will handle 400hp easily but you''re still not going to make 400hp with stock unported heads. it doesn't matter if you have a stroker crank or not and for $189 i'd stay away from that cheap ass chinese POS crank and re-use the stock crank. the stock one is probably stronger than that $189 crank anyway

[Burn 14]

My crank is already under .010 and my machinist will probably tell me it will need to go .020...and if over .020 then I think the crank is history. I'm sure they would make some $$$ if I bought a new crank from them. Who sells a decent price 351w cast nodular crank?

 

I'm okay with not getting 400hp out of the stock heads. How much HP do you think the setup will make with stock bottom end and stock head with all the other modifications...like intake, headers and camshaft? I think this motor stock is 290hp & 385ft lbs.

 

400hp might be too much power for my rookie ass anywayz.

[bnickel 10,004]

the stock crank is already a cast nodular crank. .030 under is the max and honestly i don't even like using .020 cranks if at all possible. i'd just look for a new or better stock crank. the stock heads will limit you to probably around 350hp no matter what else you do, can you get 400hp out of the stock heads? it's possible but the engine will be a beast and not very streetable.

[Max Power 74]

Yep - would agree. If you go stroker do the heads. Sorry didn't look up the stock head info but instead compared them to mine (not in size but iron). I would wait until the cash is there and do the stroker and heads at the same time. Look into the AFR 185's or maybe CHI and turn the engine into a Clevor. Now you can begin to make some real power. But as I stated and you agreed, you only want to pull the engine once. If that holds true you should also think roller rocker .v. tappet, hydraulics, etc.... Of course that means $$$$$ Good rule of thumb - what ever your budget add 50 to 100 % to the number....

 

There is a big difference between cleveland factory heads and windsor factory heads. End of story. He is asking about windsors.

[bnickel 10,004]

There is a big difference between cleveland factory heads and windsor factory heads. End of story. He is asking about windsors.

 

 

max, that's what he was saying. he said at first he didn't realize that we were talking about a windsor.

[Burn 14]

AAAWWWWW!!! I just got a killer deal on a set of cast iron World Windsor Sr. heads for $500. The guy had only 30 runs on them and decided he needed more power and told his builder to get rid of these quick. Good for me and now it looks like 450hp is in reach. The guy who sold them to me is a cam designer/engine builder and he’s talked me into getting a custom grind cam. He also can get me a Scat stroker crank for $150...so it looks a thought I’m going BIG after all...probably 408ci with a solid cam. That should be a lot of fun.

[Carguy960 10]

You should use a hydraulic roller cam. Much easier to deal with.