1970 convertible engine - concours style help

[jperls 2]

Hello everyone,

I am new to the forums (just joined) and could use a little help. I have a 1970 convertible with a number's matching engine. Very short history of the car - the car was bought in 1970 from Cort Fox Ford in Hollywood California on January 18, 1970 by the original owner. Apparently the owner got into a minor fender bender and was forced to sell the car and did so in 1971 that to none other than my mother.

In 1983 she re-painted the car to a paisley yellow color, redid-the interior to tan, and had the engine rebuilt at 135k miles.

Fast-forward to 2009 where I took over the car and re-painted it red (ok big mistake since the original color was Medium Bright Blue Poly, but at least the job was done properly and we took the car all the way down to the metal and fixed it up). At this time we also added reproduction Magnum 500 wheels to the car (second big mistake as we did not keep the original steel wheels...my mom already had gotten rid of the Argent Styled hub caps that came with the car).

So I don't want to screw up the engine bay and I would like to have people's opinions of what I should do...here is a picture of the engine before I worked on it (when the car was still yellow) and one from a couple of years ago (after I did a little work with it). Some things have changed since then and here are the faults that I know of:

1. Radiator was replaced with a 3-core aluminum radiator, thankful I still have the original and will re-core it to a 3 core at some point in time and get the correct radiator cap

2. Battery died...have a generic battery, but might buy another one of these reproduction AGM batteries

3. Fender bolts are wrong...I still have the originals and will put those back when I get a chance

4. Intake manifold is two colors - I will re-paint on the car

5. Power steering pump is wrong color (and possibly wrong dipstick handle)- entire assembly was just replaced as that pump went bad...it is now black (and works so much better, but mechanic saved my original per my request)

6. Oil dipstick has been painted ford blue

7. Missing j-clip for oil and temp sending wires on valve cover - also have zip-tie on back wires going to dashboard

8. Vacuum port switch incorrect

9. Distributor housing incorrect (I just bought an original correct date-coded Autolite housing...will transfer/rebuild distributor when I get a chance...though I don't look forward to it).

So I guess the question is should I attempt to continue a concourse engine restoration (definitely not doing a re-spray on the car...in too deep to do that) or should I just leave it alone? And if I should keep going, what other corrections do I need to make?

Thanks and I look forward to reading your comments.

[aslanefe 333]

Depends on what you want to do with the car; do you enjoy driving it or taking to shows to get trophies? Is it a high value car? I like to drive my cars, my 69 Grande is my daily driver. So I do not sweat too much about concourse stuff; the wrong color of PS pump does not bother me much (unless it is an ugly color) if the paint on the pump is in good condition, I'll use it like that instead of draining the fluid and removing it; if it is removed for some other reason and it needs paint I'll paint it to factory color. So, it is your decision as you will get all kinds of different opinions from different people (like mine) on your car.

[RogerC 136]

As mentioned above, depends on what you'll do with the car. Are you going to drive it regularly or enter it in concours events? Do you have a Marti Report? Is it something special? Or do you want to correct all those things just to be factory correct for your own reasons? I have a friend that builds mopars for the last reason but he does drive his roadrunner to shows regularly. Most of us on here aren't so concerned with factory correct but we're fine to help no matter if you are as others on here are. We all just enjoy these cars in our own way.

[jperls 2]

Ok...the car is a driver and it used to participate in some local shows. Here is the Delux Marti Report for the car as well as the Personalized Stats. I mean to me the car is special because there are a lot of memories associated with it (including learning to drive in it), but as for rarity, I am not entierly sure...but I think it might have been a little rare paint and interior combination.

MARTI REPORT.pdf Personalized Stats.pdf

[RPM 1,190]

Welcome to the forum. Where's the pics of the rest of your Mustang? We...ok, I like pics :)  As mentioned, we don't get worked up too much on non concours stuff, or concours stuff for that matter. Your 70 may be a 1 of 1, but it doesn't have the right options to make a difference. Ford made some pretty cool bolts with captured washers that work really well. Glad you're gonna put them back on. 

[aslanefe 333]

23 minutes ago, jperls said:

Ok...the car is a driver and it used to participate in some local shows. Here is the Delux Marti Report for the car as well as the Personalized Stats. I mean to me the car is special because there are a lot of memories associated with it (including learning to drive in it), but as for rarity, I am not entierly sure...but I think it might have been a little rare paint and interior combination.

MARTI REPORT.pdf 337.58 kB · 1 download Personalized Stats.pdf 793.43 kB · 1 download

In my opinion, rare paint and interior combination does not make a 70 vert with a 302 high value car (and you stated that red is not the original color) and having a sentimental value to you does not make it a high value car to others either. If you like it original, and want to spend time working on it, then painting under hood components are easy tasks.

[jperls 2]

1 hour ago, RPM said:

Welcome to the forum. Where's the pics of the rest of your Mustang? We...ok, I like pics :)  As mentioned, we don't get worked up too much on non concours stuff, or concours stuff for that matter. Your 70 may be a 1 of 1, but it doesn't have the right options to make a difference. Ford made some pretty cool bolts with captured washers that work really well. Glad you're gonna put them back on. 

 

[jperls 2]

58 minutes ago, aslanefe said:

In my opinion, rare paint and interior combination does not make a 70 vert with a 302 high value car (and you stated that red is not the original color) and having a sentimental value to you does not make it a high value car to others either. If you like it original, and want to spend time working on it, then painting under hood components are easy tasks.

Noted...I know if this was one of the 196 with the 428 cobra-jet engines this would be a completely different story (and trust me it would have been a very different restoration). That being said, I just want to keep the engine looking good and give people a nice example of a number's matching engine that they can work off of for their projects. One of the things I know is that a popular upgrade was to put on the 351 heads. I don't know if painting under hood components is "an easy task" since I think I might have to pull the engine to do this properly. Is it complicated to pull the engine? Do you think it is possible to do an engine re-spray in the car?

[aslanefe 333]

6 hours ago, jperls said:

Noted...I know if this was one of the 196 with the 428 cobra-jet engines this would be a completely different story (and trust me it would have been a very different restoration). That being said, I just want to keep the engine looking good and give people a nice example of a number's matching engine that they can work off of for their projects. One of the things I know is that a popular upgrade was to put on the 351 heads. I don't know if painting under hood components is "an easy task" since I think I might have to pull the engine to do this properly. Is it complicated to pull the engine? Do you think it is possible to do an engine re-spray in the car?

When I said under hood components, I meant the valve covers, air cleaner, PS pump etc; never re-sprayed an engine while it is in the car so I do not know if it is possible. But if I had to paint a whole engine and wanted to do it right, I would remove it. If you have the proper tools (including an engine hoist) and mechanically inclined, it is not complicated, but one thing to keep in mind is; on an old car you can always run into problems, like broken exhaust stud , water pump bolt etc and fixing those may require more tools and effort.

[Mike65 475]

Welcome to the forum. Nice looking Vert.

[RPM 1,190]

13 hours ago, jperls said:

 

Nice looking background, where abouts you live?

[jperls 2]

1 hour ago, RPM said:

Nice looking background, where abouts you live?

Im in Southern Cailfornia...Westlake Village area. You?

[Mach1 Driver 560]

Alas, it only stays green for a few weeks in spring and is brown the rest of the year. I do miss the weather though.

[RPM 1,190]

8 hours ago, jperls said:

Im in Southern Cailfornia...Westlake Village area. You?

Ah nice, I've golfed at Sherwood CC. I'm up in Bakersfield. Got a brother in law who lives in Wood Ranch, and an ex who lives below the Reagan Library. 

[jperls 2]

Ok a couple of questions for everyone...

So I am looking more closely at my "before" and "after" pictures and I have noticed a couple of things: that the vacuum advance on the original distributor is a dual diaphragm, but the second hose to the advance is not connected.

1. Does this mean I could get away with running a single diaphragm distributor?

2. Did this model year come with the "yellow top" ignition coil?

3. Did these engines normally come with the longer snorkel / vacuum operated temperature door or the shorter thermostatic kind? 

Here is a picture of the engine that I took this morning so you can see its current state (the ones I provided were before the restoration and one from when it was in "really good shape"

 

Thank you

[69RavenConv 286]

1. The dual diaphragm advance is generally considered an emissions control and engines can run without it. It just depends upon how "correct" you want restoration to look. In fact, many say you should run without it.

2.  Pretty sure the yellow top was in use until at least the early 70's, so it should be correct for your 1970.

3. By 1969 (and maybe earlier) the thermostatic door was in use, so the "after" picture looks right.

4.  You didn't ask but I think the oil breather should be black, not engine blue.

 

[Mach1 Driver 560]

1 hour ago, 69RavenConv said:

2.  Pretty sure the yellow top was in use until at least the early 70's, so it should be correct for your 1970.

4.  You didn't ask but I think the oil breather should be black, not engine blue.

 

Mine was made in March of 69 and has a yellow top. Also agree on black for the oil breather. 

[redmastercraft 10]

If you're looking for concours advice you really need to go to the concours forum.  Just google concours mustang forum and you'll find it.  BTW every Mardi report I have seen has the car 1 of 1 for something.  He does that to make every car special...my car included and it's pretty bare bones.

[Rich Ackermann 174]

Welcome! You have a very nice looking, unmolested vert. Color is a personal choice and your red vert looks great, and if you like it, that is all that matters. I once painted a very original 1973 red convertible Mustang Gold Glow Metallic, and some folks scratched their heads wondering why I would do that.

Anyway, Mustang Club of America publishes their Concourse Judging rules for Trailered, Street Driven classes, and so on. It will give you an idea what they consider a concourse car and what the finish on various parts/areas on the car should be. If you apply MCA Judging rules as the standard (which is debatable) for a concourse restoration, then I recommend reading before attempting a "Concourse" restoration. 

See attached...

MCAMustangRules69-70-2019.pdf

[jperls 2]

Thank you so much for the info...this will help me a lot.

 

[barnett468 418]

You can not get a rad core with the factory size tubes anymore, therefore, you should get a 4 row core if you can.

I have nos motocraft distributor caps if you need one.

you can get the concours spark plug wires and battery cables from kevin marti if you dont already have them

deadnutson.com also has some rare concours parts as well as semo mustang and mansfield  mustang and perogies

[jperls 2]

On 6/19/2020 at 8:57 PM, barnett468 said:

You can not get a rad core with the factory size tubes anymore, therefore, you should get a 4 row core if you can.

I have nos motocraft distributor caps if you need one.

you can get the concours spark plug wires and battery cables from kevin marti if you dont already have them

deadnutson.com also has some rare concours parts as well as semo mustang and mansfield  mustang and perogies

 I looked at the concoursmustang.com forum and asked about my engine. In short, I got mutilated on the condition of the engine...decided I should just be happy with the driver that I have and forget restoring the engine concours style...don't have the time or the money. However I did check deadnutson.com and have already bought some parts and created a list of parts that I want. 

Also there is one part that I just got extremely lucky with...a NOS charcoal canister to air cleaner evap hose...the cardboard/paper kind...not the aluminum hose I have on now. looking forward to getting it. Will only use it at shows

[Rich Ackermann 174]

I think you made the right decision. Concourse trailered/street driven levels are over rated. Its just more trouble than its worth and you will not drive the car as much for fear of cleaning it endlessly or something doing damage to all your work. Restore just the things that you want to and you will enjoy your car more. Good Luck!