One Hyd Lifter not pumped up

[ralt962 11]

I finally had my car on the road last weekend after 6 years.  Last year I did get to run the engine at about 2200 rpm for 20 min. to break in the cam.  All new cam, lifters, rockers heads ect.

Running it last weekend it did pretty well.  Good power, but driven easy.  

Today it would start easily but run very rough.  Could not idle.  Running about 1500 rpm still running rough.

Went to make sure the roller rockers were still set right, I found one lifter that was not pumped up on #1 intake.  All the rest were the same.

Not sure if this is my run rough issue or timing or vacuum leak.  

My question, do you think the lifter will pump back up?  Not sure why it would go from running ok to being as rough as it is.

 

 

[barnett468 418]

Is it a comp cams lifter?

Did you try to adjust it again?

They should be around 1/2 turn in from zero.

[ralt962 11]

Crane Cam Lifter with Comp cam roller rockers.  I was going back through to make sure the rockers were set to the 1/2 turn.  Thats when I found the one that is not pumped up.

I've readjusted all of them.  Going to try running it again today.  It doesn't seem reasonable that only 1 lifter would not pump up when the others have unless something else is wrong.

 

[barnett468 418]

keep us posted . shouldn't have a problem with crane lifters but it's possible it's defective. if you have push in rocker studs the stud can also pull out of the head.

[Ridge Runner 1,112]

I love comp cams cams ,but i hate their lifters ,i usually replace them with crane lifters ,never had a problem with them 

[ralt962 11]

It ran pretty well.  Still a tic or two in there.  Not sure what this was about.

The really rough idle was due to a vacuum line popped off.  Drove about 10 miles ran ok.  Still  better but still rough idle.  The lifter I dont think is the issue.  I have either more vacuum leaks or the carb is not set well enough.  Going work with timing and check for more vacuum issues next.  

Appreciate the suggestions. 

[Ridge Runner 1,112]

What gasket did you use between the carb and intake ,thin gaskets will leak ,the thicker gsskets work best 

[barnett468 418]

11 hours ago, Ridge Runner said:

What gasket did you use between the carb and intake ,thin gaskets will leak ,the thicker gsskets work best 

Lol, yeah, there are some super thin, ie super crappy carb base gaskets out there

[ralt962 11]

Found it.  A vacuum port on the manifold under the carb had split.  Couldnt see it.  Put on a vacuum gauge and found I was very low.  Went back to that cap that I had trouble with and found the split.  New cap and clamp.  Up to 16 lbs.  Now it runs and idles.  Its driveable again.  Now I need a bit of tunning in the carb.  I have the two screws on the sides set at  1 1/2 turns right now.  

But I will check the carb gasket.  It came with the carb.  Holley 650.  Likely cheap paper.

[Ridge Runner 1,112]

Fell pro has a thick gasket for Holley patern ,cant remember the part number ,but i have removed a carb and put it back with the same thick gasket and never leaked. It is the one with plastic eyelets

[ralt962 11]

Thanks Ridge,  I'll go after that one.  Want to seal it as best I can.

[ralt962 11]

Well an new update to this one.  I now believe that lifter is not pumping up.  Engine runs pretty well but feels like a miss.  

I checked the exhaust temps using and infrared gun.  This cylinder is 100 deg cooler than the others.    Its #1.  Timing light works on this cylinder so I'm getting spark.  The plug was wet with what looks like fuel.  

Starting the car, I get around 130 deg on the header compared to 230 on the other headers.   Have not tried a compression tester yet.  But if the intake is not opening that wont tell much.  

Any suggestions on fixing a single lifter?  Have not pulled it out yet.  

[barnett468 418]

If it is not pumping up it will tick. It will also often squirt oil around 2 feet out of the push rod.

If you definitively determine it is the lifter and not something else like a flat cam lobe etc, I would replace it instead of trying to disassemble it and fix it.

,

[1969_Mach1 333]

The old-timer method of fixing sticky lifters (if that's what is causing the tick) is to change the oil and filter and when refilling the oil pour in about a half quart of ATF.  In real bad cases I've heard of a full quart of ATF.  Of course make certain the remainder of the motor oil is the type with high ZDDP content if you have a flat tappet cam.  The ATF has a lot of detergent in it.  If it were mine, I'd change the oil and filter again after soon after the lifter noise stopped to get the ATF out of the motor.  I've done it a couple of times on old motors and it worked both times.

As far as those thick carb base gaskets, avoid the type that are coated with a black tar-like coating.  When it gets hot it sticks to the carb and intake badly.  I just purchased two of those thick gaskets made by Holley and they are nice, no black tar-like coating.  Also, if you have a dual plane intake, get the thick gasket with a center divider.

[ralt962 11]

Thanks for the suggestions.  I can check the cam lob by taking the rocker off and seeing what movement I get.  Last time I had the valve cover off I could compress the lifter by hand.  Which tells me there is no oil in it.  Oil would squirt out or I couldnt push it down.   I'll have to take the intake off and pull the lifter.

Hope thats all it is. Wiped cam would be a bit more work.  But hey thats what we have these cars for.  

[ralt962 11]

Another update on this one.  I think its a wiped lobe.  Pulling the rocker arm I rotated the engine.  The push rod moved 0.118".  But there is a wear pattern on the push rod all the way around, but below where I just measured.  The wear pattern is about 0.48" which is close to right.  The fact that its lower down and I can compress the lifter easily.  Could the lifter be stuck up higher in its bore so I'm not really getting movement?

I'll have to pull the intake and see if I can measure the cam lift through the lifter bore (unless the lifter is stuck in there).

Any suggestions appreciated.

[barnett468 418]

no need to measure anything. just remove the lifter and look at the cam lobe and bottom of the lifter. if they are not smooth, they are bad.

 

[ralt962 11]

Barnett,  any idea why it would have gone bad?  Used lots of assembly lube, used zinc oil and added a quote of what Crane Cams recommends.  

But I did have low oil pressure early on due to the wrong pickup tube.  When they say Small Block Ford they don't mean 351.  Found out the hard way.  Not sure if that was it.  But could have been.

thanks.  Pull the intake next.  

[barnett468 418]

1 hour ago, ralt962 said:

Barnett,  any idea why it would have gone bad?  Used lots of assembly lube, used zinc oil and added a quote of what Crane Cams recommends.  

But I did have low oil pressure early on due to the wrong pickup tube.  When they say Small Block Ford they don't mean 351.  Found out the hard way.  Not sure if that was it.  But could have been.

thanks.  Pull the intake next.  

newish cams cams go bad for a variety of reasons with the main ones being improper break in including improper break in oil etc, and too high of a valve spring pressure.

 

[ralt962 11]

Thought I would write the final chapter on this one.  Finally was able to dive into the engine.  

Bottom line it was a wiped cam lobe.  The reason the lifter would not pump up is the cam had warn the lifter down so far that there was a hole in the bottom of the lifter.  Oil would pump back out.  So I was able to push on the top of the rocker and compress the lifter.  There was no lobe left on the cam.  almost machined completely round.  

Root cause of this was the fact that I installed a 302 pick up tube.  New to building Ford engines I was fooled by the "small block Ford" designation.  Fortunately I had so many rear seal leak issues that I constantly changed the oil and filter.  I Must have washed all the bits out on a regular basis.  One of my 5 replacements of the pan and seal I checked the bearings and all looked good, surprisingly.