70 Conv wiring issues

[Caseyrhe 650]

Son has interior done, looking good. Maiden voyage was a success. Power steering hooked up and steers so much better. Now to my nightmare, electrical issues!!

1) brake lights don’t work. Have power to one side of the switch (green with red stripe) when jumping switch , still no lights. Continuity from taillights to plug is good, so issue some where behind dash?

2) headlights don’t work, have power to plug at headlights on 2 of the 3 wires at plug when hitting high beam switch, so assume 3rd is a ground. When testing off positive side of battery with test light, 3rd wire not grounded(lite didn’t come in)

3) highbeam indicator stays on when low beam or high beam wires have power to either at headlight

4) dash lights not working

5) all running lights and tail lights work, but both front left  and rear side markers only burn dim, even with new bulbs

6) blinker indicators and rear turn signals work but blink real slow, maybe 2 seconds between blink. 

[aslanefe 333]

Sounds like bad ground connection to me.

[Mach1 Driver 560]

Look on this site in How to's, A Real Schematic

[Caseyrhe 650]

I have looked at those, what are the chances of the getting the wire color descriptions listed

[Caseyrhe 650]

not seeing a ground either

[Mach1 Driver 560]

2 hours ago, Caseyrhe said:

I have looked at those, what are the chances of the getting the wire color descriptions listed

Nope sorry, you want a wire diagram- they are two different things. This may sound nonsensical, but a schematic doesn't show all the wires, it shows how the components are connected in the least cluttered way so you can see how it works, not how its wired. It shows the condition in which switches are closed (think about that). A schematic doesn't show wires, wire colors, plugs, splices etc. Invest in a wire diagram if you want to know how its wired. This is the only schematic for a classic and it will show you how it works clearly and at a glance. The engineer will start with a schematic and then make a wire diagram. The wire diagram I used to backward engineer the schematic is for both 69 Cougars and Mustangs and is 37 pages long, printed on 11x17 paper. I bought the shop manuals and diagram in 69 from Helm. I've heard Osborne has good ones but I've not seen them.

To diagnose a problem use the schematic to figure out how it works and where to take voltage measurements. Use the wire diagram to identify "where you are in the circuit" by seeing the colors, actual wires, plugs, splices and components. If you put all that stuff on a schematic it would be too complicated to figure out how it works- and be a wire diagram. Sometimes you need both but I rarely need the diagram.

[danno 128]

On 5/10/2018 at 9:32 PM, Caseyrhe said:

Son has interior done, looking good. Maiden voyage was a success. Power steering hooked up and steers so much better. Now to my nightmare, electrical issues!!

1) brake lights don’t work. Have power to one side of the switch (green with red stripe) when jumping switch , still no lights. Continuity from taillights to plug is good, so issue some where behind dash?

2) headlights don’t work, have power to plug at headlights on 2 of the 3 wires at plug when hitting high beam switch, so assume 3rd is a ground. When testing off positive side of battery with test light, 3rd wire not grounded(lite didn’t come in)

3) highbeam indicator stays on when low beam or high beam wires have power to either at headlight

4) dash lights not working

5) all running lights and tail lights work, but both front left  and rear side markers only burn dim, even with new bulbs

6) blinker indicators and rear turn signals work but blink real slow, maybe 2 seconds between blink. 

1) it seems like it is the turn signal or emergency flasher switch. disconnect the turn signal switch at the half moon connector under the steering column.  Short the green wire ( it comes from the brake switch) to the orange &blue wire.  Then press the brake, and you should get the right rear brake light to turn on.   If this works, then something is wrong with the connections in the turn signal switch.  If this does not work, then check back on more ideas

2)  there is a ground that is not connected.  It is a bunch of black wires that are under a screw somewhere under the radiator. I have a 69, and it is a different location on a 70.  Look for the bunch of black wires with tied together.

3) same thing as 2) above.  No ground on the headlights will cause this exact thing.  I know why, but it is difficult to explain.

4) dash lights go through a fuse, and that is probably the issue. Turn the dash light dimmer all the way up and measure the voltage on the little short fuse in the fuse block.  You should have 12 volts on both sides of the fuse when the lights are supposed to be on

5) again, probably a bad ground for the bulbs. not sure where the ground connection is, but that is probably it.  If you take the bulb out and measure the voltage, it will probably be 12 volts.  With the bulb in, it would be less.

6) More than likely low voltage.  Make sure the voltage on the battery is at least 12.5 volts with the engine off,  14 volts with the engine running. If you have these voltages, again, a bad ground could do it. 

Verify you have a good connection between the battery minus and the engine, and you MUST also have a ground wire between the engine and the chassis. If you are missing this separate single ground wire, that explains a lot.  In a 1969 it bolts to the passenger side cylinder head to the firewall.  

report on these and get back to us. 

 

[Caseyrhe 650]

Danny, thanks for the response, I will try to dig back into this tomorrow. In the process of selling my house, which went on the mls Thursday, and having to make sudden departures with 2 dogs is about to do me in. 

[Caseyrhe 650]

On 5/12/2018 at 4:40 PM, danno said:

1) it seems like it is the turn signal or emergency flasher switch. disconnect the turn signal switch at the half moon connector under the steering column.  Short the green wire ( it comes from the brake switch) to the orange &blue wire.  Then press the brake, and you should get the right rear brake light to turn on.   If this works, then something is wrong with the connections in the turn signal switch.  If this does not work, then check back on more ideas

2)  there is a ground that is not connected.  It is a bunch of black wires that are under a screw somewhere under the radiator. I have a 69, and it is a different location on a 70.  Look for the bunch of black wires with tied together.

3) same thing as 2) above.  No ground on the headlights will cause this exact thing.  I know why, but it is difficult to explain.

4) dash lights go through a fuse, and that is probably the issue. Turn the dash light dimmer all the way up and measure the voltage on the little short fuse in the fuse block.  You should have 12 volts on both sides of the fuse when the lights are supposed to be on

5) again, probably a bad ground for the bulbs. not sure where the ground connection is, but that is probably it.  If you take the bulb out and measure the voltage, it will probably be 12 volts.  With the bulb in, it would be less.

6) More than likely low voltage.  Make sure the voltage on the battery is at least 12.5 volts with the engine off,  14 volts with the engine running. If you have these voltages, again, a bad ground could do it. 

Verify you have a good connection between the battery minus and the engine, and you MUST also have a ground wire between the engine and the chassis. If you are missing this separate single ground wire, that explains a lot.  In a 1969 it bolts to the passenger side cylinder head to the firewall.  

report on these and get back to us. 

 

1) did as you said, rear brake light came on. So connected the brake switch up, shorted wires, and no brake light...so switch prob bad to. 

2) found ground wire up front, connected, and bingo lights came on

3) dimmer indicator works now

4) replaced light switch, dash lights work along with dimmer

5) with headlights on, left dash turn indicator glows, when you flip it up (as taking right turn) left tail light comes on but doesn’t blink. Side marker lights burn bright. Did also find the black wire at the signal harness plug was cut, found end tucked up in sleeve, connected, but no change in out come  

So will need to get a new turn signal switch. 

Thanks Danno for your response, will update after new switch installed  

Just an FYI- CJ sales the side marker light holder/socket for around 9 bucks, found the same at A Zone for 3 bucks. Fit great!!

 

 

[Midlife 814]

8 hours ago, Caseyrhe said:

5) with headlights on, left dash turn indicator glows, when you flip it up (as taking right turn) left tail light comes on but doesn’t blink. Side marker lights burn bright. Did also find the black wire at the signal harness plug was cut, found end tucked up in sleeve, connected, but no change in out come  

 

 

 

Was this black wire coming out of the dash cluster connector?  It is not to be connected, as it helps strengthen the crimp of a single strand resistor wire.  DO NOT ground this wire!

[Caseyrhe 650]

It was still connected on the dash harness half moon clip, but cut just above the clip on the harness going to the turn signal switch.

Non-tach dash

[Midlife 814]

That is the wiring for the warning lamp for door ajar.  That black line goes to a relay on the passenger side.

[Caseyrhe 650]

Rodger That

[Caseyrhe 650]

Update, brake switch replaced and right rear brake light comes on using jumper on green and orange/blue

Have a new switch ordered

checking continuity from 1/2 moon plug and contacts on blinker switch, all were good. Pulling hazard switch, front turn signals blink along with both rear side marker lights....but no taillights. 

Wth? Not freaking out just yet knowing switch is bad. 

Mid, the black wire that u said not to hook up goes to ign switch- pictured. Will I need to cut it loose when I get the blinker switch assembly?

[Caseyrhe 650]

Just now, Caseyrhe said:

Update, brake switch replaced and right rear brake light comes on using jumper on green and orange/blue

Have a new switch ordered

checking continuity from 1/2 moon plug and contacts on blinker switch, all were good. Pulling hazard switch, front turn signals blink along with both rear side marker lights....but no taillights. 

Wth? Not freaking out just yet knowing switch is bad. 

Mid, the black wire that u said not to hook up goes to ign switch- pictured. Will I need to cut it loose when I get the blinker switch assembly?

Clarification-right rear brake light comes on when jumped and brake applied

new turn signal switch ordered 

[Midlife 814]

I honestly don't know.  You first said it came from the signal harness, which I interpreted to mean the dash cluster.  You later clarified it was the turn signal switch connector.  Now you're showing a picture of a ground wire, possibly associated with the ignition switch.  I don't know what I am seeing here...Sorry.  The picture is part of the circuitry I rarely if ever see in my shop. 

[Caseyrhe 650]

New blinker arrived and is in. Brake light switch is in-

Brake lights work

Right turn signal blinks, indicator blinks also

Left signal does not blink, indicator comes on also

tail lights work, but left side markers are still dim and left turn indicator lights up

hazards worked for a minute or so, both sides blinked faster than right turn signal did, indicators blinked,  then all quit.

Anybody have any suggestions on where to start next

 

[Vicfreg 771]

The picture in your post is shows a 1970 steering column...The black wire you show coming off of the ignition switch is for the "buzzer" that goes off when you leave your key in. This was used for certain models, and is a '70 feature that is not shared with '69s.  

Mine is cut and capped.  You may also see this black wire on the lower connector.  I cut and capped it there as well.

With respect to your other issues, sounds to me like you have a grounding issue.    Make sure your harness grounds are clean and solid.   

Make some temporary jumpers with alligator clips and use them to ground some of the items that are not working.  See if that helps.

I have a fairly complete 1970 convertible original wiring harness that I am not using, would be happy to sell to you if you want it.  I went with a AAW harness on my car. You can PM me for details.

[gordonr 4]

When the park lights on only does the left turn indicator come on in the dash?

[Caseyrhe 650]

Yes, with only parking lights on, left blinker indicator stays on

[gordonr 4]

Having the t/s indicator on with park lights activated usually indicates a bad ground on the that light bulb. When the park light filament cant find a ground thru its base it and associated black wire  to ground will find another way. That way is thru the turn signal filament back up to the indicator on your dash illuminating it. The poor ground can be due to a couple of issues like corrosion in the light socket, corrosion in the pigtail or a bad light light assembly.  Pull the lens off and while your testing also verify the right bulb is in there it is an 1157a dual filament.

[Midlife 814]

6 hours ago, gordonr said:

Having the t/s indicator on with park lights activated usually indicates a bad ground on the that light bulb. When the park light filament cant find a ground thru its base it and associated black wire  to ground will find another way. That way is thru the turn signal filament back up to the indicator on your dash illuminating it. The poor ground can be due to a couple of issues like corrosion in the light socket, corrosion in the pigtail or a bad light light assembly.  Pull the lens off and while your testing also verify the right bulb is in there it is an 1157a dual filament.

Gordon is right on here. 

[Caseyrhe 650]

Thanks Gordon, will give that a shot when the opportunity arises......moving and garage is riddled with boxes

[Caseyrhe 650]

Fixed!! All made changes in the right direction-

replaced turn signal switch

replaced both front side marker sockets that were corroded 

replaced signal flasher

But left turn signal indicator still lite up with head light switch on and both front and rear side markers were dim and had power to both sides,

replaced front left turn signal...Bam!! Problem solved