Which headlights are bright and fit?

[lanky 44]

I have been reading everything I can find on headlights for our 69's. A lot of information is conflicting, and I am basically back at square one. My two concerns are fitment and how good the lenses/housings are therefore projection. If you have any input please chime in!

Starting with OE style sealed beams there are Philips h5001 (Hi) and h5006 (split-beam) that I'm assuming are a direct fit. I really want something better than these if I can do it without too much trouble/$$. Then there's the Wagner Sealed Beam Halogens with the same #'s. I'm assuming these are also a direct fit,  (1) has anyone used these and (2) are they any better than the standard sealed beams? 

Please apply same q's as above for the Scott Drake sealed beam halogens (3) and (4). I don't know who manufactures for them.

I want bright lighting and would prefer more white light than the factory sealed beams provide. A near-miss with a deer has me pretty motivated about this. I want lights that will correctly fit in the buckets and not be crooked or anything. I don't mind trimming the backside of the buckets but I would prefer not to. I purchased Maxtel "conversion" H4 lenses/bulbs that were supposed to be a direct fit replacement for sealed beam h5001/5006's but they don't fit very good even after I modified the mounting tabs. 

(4) Is the heat from Halogens anything to worry about? If this is the case then we are all outta luck either way (LED's aside).

Then through Daniel Stern Lighting I see the Cibie H4 Split-beams and the H1 Hi's. (5) Has anyone used these and what were the results? I read that at some point the production of these changed or something and they were no longer very good, maybe that was just misinformation.

I have the same q's as above for the Hella Vision Plus H4 Split-beams and H1 Hi's. I tend to think Hella would make a good product, but perhaps that is just riding on their reputation.

I am not considering LED's for cost alone, my understanding is the only good ones are very pricey plus the cheaper ones look terrible visually to me.

Let this be the most comprehensive headlight thread so that others have somewhere to look! Thanks

 

[Mike65 475]

I found these at Summit Racing & they say they will fit the 69 Mustang buckets. They are pricey & do NOT come with bulbs.

https://www.summitracing.com/parts/hla-002850001

[lanky 44]

I am leaning towards those. Seem reasonably priced. Anyone have problems related to heat from running halogens? Summit is so good about returns there's no harm trying them if heat isn't a problem.

[aslanefe 333]

2 hours ago, lanky said:

I am leaning towards those. Seem reasonably priced. Anyone have problems related to heat from running halogens? Summit is so good about returns there's no harm trying them if heat isn't a problem.

I have been using halogen bulbs and glass reflective headlights on my 70 Grande since 95 without heat being a problem. I have relays and thicker wires for them. I think the headlights I used were for a Fiat 124.

[Mach1 Driver 560]

EDIT EDIT

This is the latest information as of 1-20-18. The 69s have a problem because of the small 5.75 diameter lights. New lights have become available in the H4 format that are acceptable. While the Koito H4 is not as good on low beams as a Hella BiFocal H1, the Koito is still substantially better than the old sealed beams.

This information comes from Daniel Stern, and the  halogen lights he suggests are the only lights I found that have photometry to show you the actual light pattern. They are DOT approved. Too much light going up tends to reflect back and bedazzel the driver, especially if there is rain or fog. Stern suggests several brands and they are all detailed on the attached schematic titled Headlights.pdf. Pictures are on the accompanying MS Word.doc titled Headlight3.doc. The different types of lights require different wiring, so I made a schematic for each type. It took many many emails to Stern to pry all the information out of him. He does not give part numbers, so if you want to get the correct parts you will have to get them from him. His website shows the bulbs, Cibies, and Hellas, but as of this writing the Koitos are not shown. He also has some relays and harnesses, but I don't think he has both types of harnesses, so beware of what you are buying.

You will need to add a couple of relays and a harness wired directly to the battery because these halogens pull substantially more amps and will fry your light switch and wires.

Stern has finally found DOT approved LEDs. The link is in a later post below. I don't care for them because they look like multifaceted bug eyes.

All the other LED lights that I looked at are made by tiny little companies that don't do any testing. They are not DOT approved and I don't recommend them.

HEADLIGHTS.pdf

headlights3.doc

Edited January 20, 2018 by Mach1 Driver
new information

[RPM 1,190]

"Stern suggests Cubie parabolic Hi beams ($79), with Flosser/Narva Rangepower+50 bulbs ($15.59). For low beams use Hella BiFocal Hi Low beams ($139) "

Excellent work you've done Mach1 Driver. I'm pretty much illiterate on this topic, but is the headlight brand Cibie and not Cubie? Search kept showing results for Cibie when I entered Cutie.

Thanks again. 

[lanky 44]

I just finished my relay install with 12 gauge wires everywhere, came out great.  Mach1 if not H4 what style are the Hella BiFocal lamps and do you have a part number? I haven't come across those at all. I saw the Cibie's on Daniel Sterns website and those are H4's as well which you are saying to stay away from.

[Mach1 Driver 560]

On 1/15/2018 at 12:19 PM, RPM said:

I'm pretty much illiterate on this topic, but is the headlight brand Cibie and not Cubie? Search kept showing results for Cibie when I entered Cutie.

Thanks again. 

I misspelled it, it is Cibie. By the way, the 4 stock 69 lights have a total of 6 filaments, and it needs to be reconfigured to only 4 filaments when installing the relays for the halogens. I edited my first post and added schematics.

Edited January 20, 2018 by Mach1 Driver
new information

[aslanefe 333]

1 minute ago, Mach1 Driver said:

I misspelled it, it is Cibie. By the way, the 4 stock 69 lights have a total of 6 filaments, and it needs to be reconfigured to only 4 filaments when installing the relays for the halogens. I can make a schematic and post it here if anyone expresses an interest.

I am sure there will be interest for the schematic.

[Mach1 Driver 560]

On 1/15/2018 at 3:45 PM, lanky said:

 Mach1 if not H4 what style are the Hella BiFocal lamps and do you have a part number?

Talk to Stern to get the part numbers and see my first post which has been edited. 

Edited January 20, 2018 by Mach1 Driver
new information

[RPM 1,190]

Yes absolutely post a schematic. I would certainly use it. 

Thanks Mach1 Driver.

 

[Mach1 Driver 560]

The schematic is almost complete- I sent an email to Daniel Stern to get the part numbers so I can lookup the bulb and specify the wire gauge- because I know someone will ask (and rightfully so). Patience is a virtue (I don't have).

[lanky 44]

I would like a schematic as well, I didn't realize there would be wiring changes to do this. I thought H4 sockets were the same as our Lo/Hi with 3 terminals. I did see H1's self ground or something like that and have a different style connector.

[Mach1 Driver 560]

EDIT, EDIT, EDIT

see my first post which I have edited

Below is LED information that was in this post originally:
Also, there are finally DOT approved LEDs but they are very expensive and look like multifaceted  bug eyes to me, but he swears they are excellent headlights. http://www.jwspeaker.com/products/led-headlights-model-8630-evolution/ with no DL, and no turn signal, or http://www.jwspeaker.com/products/led-headlight-model-8631-evolution/ with internal halo ring lit in dim white for the parking light function, bright white for daytime running light function, and bright amber for the turn signal function. He says they are thoroughly outstanding but cost $330/390 each respectively. Not my cup of tea.

 

Edited January 20, 2018 by Mach1 Driver
new information

[moodster 55]

My 69 certainly has a lot of problems but luckily the headlights aren't one of them.  I used the Mustang Project LED lights.  I haven't had a chance to get the beam patterns that Mach1Driver requested - I guess I just don't have the desire to go through all the trouble - but I can tell you I drove 1290 miles last weekend in the car and the headlights work fantastic.  I don't get any complaints from other drivers and on the dark roads, of which I drove probably a dozen hours on, my beam pattern looked much like my wife's 2010 F150.  I'm not a lighting expert but given my experiences, they just plain work for me.  Now before I sound like an endorsement for Mustang Project, I can tell you that I just threw their rear LED tail lights in the trash.  I've only had them for 2-3 years but the design was poor and trouble prone for a car that gets driven a lot.  

david

[Vicfreg 771]

What is the "jumper" wire for on the schematic?   Seems to me that what it does is keeps the low beams on when you use the foot switch to engage the high beams?

[Mach1 Driver 560]

On 1/16/2018 at 6:12 PM, Vicfreg said:

What is the "jumper" wire for on the schematic?   Seems to me that what it does is keeps the low beams on when you use the foot switch to engage the high beams?

Correct, but there are now two schematics depending on the lights you choose. See my first post which has been edited.

Edited January 20, 2018 by Mach1 Driver
new information

[lanky 44]

Why can't I find any information on both the Kiota h4 Lo/HI's or the Koito HI's? Notice not same brand.

I don't understand that chart at all. So in LO mode the best outer lamps are the Hella Bifocals, but if we are in HI mode the best outer lamps are the Kiota?

And for inner lamps (HI's)  "Koitos" are best? Where can I find these to look at?

[stangs-R-me 120]

I've had Cibie 57-28-02 H4 lamps with 55/65W bulbs for the outer LO/HI and GE # 4537 100W Aircraft Landing Light High Beams on my car since the 80's.   Made my own custom harness with fuses and relays that is stealth-fully tucked in the passenger side headlight bucket.

The Cibie's are DOT compliant for motorcycles (FMVSS 108) and personally think they give a great beam pattern on my car and have never had any issues or complaints.   Low beam function and vision I feel is comparable if not better than modern HID's that I've had on my 2011 & 2016 Mustangs.  

The ACLL are the same bulbs that cops used for their 5-3/4" high beams back in the day (both marked & unmarked).   When I switch the high beams on, I swear those ACLL wilt leaves on trees !!

Headlight buckets do need some slight modding to get the ACLL's to fit ... I'm 99% sure there were no issues with the Cibie outers fitment.

The clear lens and flat face of the ACLL's just gives the car such a vintage and sinister look.   Cops today have no clue what they are (as far as getting grief with car parked) and as long as you only turn them on when there is no other traffic, who will know. 

Doug 

 

[Mach1 Driver 560]

On 1/17/2018 at 10:20 PM, lanky said:

Why can't I find any information on both the Kiota h4 Lo/HI's or the Koito HI's? Notice not same brand.

I don't understand that chart at all. So in LO mode the best outer lamps are the Hella Bifocals, but if we are in HI mode the best outer lamps are the Kiota?

And for inner lamps (HI's)  "Koitos" are best? Where can I find these to look at?

see my first post above for the latest information

[lanky 44]

Stangs-r-me thank you for your experience and pictures/part numbers. I will certainly consider aclls for the hi's, do you remember what was required for those to fit?

I don't doubt that Stern knows his stuff but I don't like blindly buying something without knowing what it is. I do understand the wiring difference if I run h1 outers. Searching "Kiota" didn't turn much results for me.

[stangs-R-me 120]

8 minutes ago, lanky said:

Stangs-r-me thank you for your experience and pictures/part numbers. I will certainly consider aclls for the hi's, do you remember what was required for those to fit?

I don't doubt that Stern knows his stuff but I don't like blindly buying something without knowing what it is. I do understand the wiring difference if I run h1 outers. Searching "Kiota" didn't turn much results for me.

I last replaced them with new in 1999 (old ones had fogged up).   The locating tabs are in different places so slots that match need to be cut into buckets.   I want to say it might just be one wide locating tab.   What I did back in the 80's is hard to say, but were I to do today, I'd probably mark the location(s) and use a small cut-off wheel to make slots.

Doug      

[Mach1 Driver 560]

I have new information from Daniel Stern. See my first post above for the latest.

[lanky 44]

That is very helpful. I'm not fully decided on high beams, but it seems that the Hella "BiFocals" (which I suspect are actually the Hella Vision Plus since I can't find a product by that name) are the way to go for outers.

One question, when switching to the h1 style outers, can't you just connect the 2 leads which were the positives for hi and low together? I was thinking it would probably be easier to buy 2 male headlight plugs and splice the 2 positive leads into 1 and then add whatever style connector is used for h1 style housings. 

[Mach1 Driver 560]

2 hours ago, lanky said:

That is very helpful. I'm not fully decided on high beams, but it seems that the Hella "BiFocals" (which I suspect are actually the Hella Vision Plus since I can't find a product by that name) are the way to go for outers.

One question, when switching to the h1 style outers, can't you just connect the 2 leads which were the positives for hi and low together? I was thinking it would probably be easier to buy 2 male headlight plugs and splice the 2 positive leads into 1 and then add whatever style connector is used for h1 style housings. 

Yes it is frustrating that he won't give the part numbers or apparently even the proper names. I'm not exactly sure what you have in mind. You need a relay between the light switch and the headlight or you will overload the light switch, wire and connectors (firewall etc) from there up to the headlights. It drags about 48% more current in low and 28% more in high, so that's enough to worry about. Draw a picture if possible.