Is it necessary to reinforce shock towers

[prayers1 153]

Larry, that is a scratch in the paint.

 

I figured if I have to take the car somewhere to get the Shock Tower work done, then I might as well get the Sub Frame Connectors done too.

 

The guy I trust and use to work on my car can't get to it until next year. We both agreed on a mobile welder that we both know who came come to my house to do the Shock Tower work and Yes I can do the SFC at a later date.

 

I vaguely understood the work needed to do the Shock Tower reinforcements, now I see that the coil spring needs to be out and the UCA needs to be detached from the spindle to do the outside brace.

 

FYI- I live in a very rural area, not many shops want to do this work or have the time for it. They rather do insurance repair jobs.

 

So I was thinking, If I can get a guy to come to my house to weld up the braces, do I have to use all of the braces that come with the kit.  In other words, are some braces more important to have than others. This will cut down on the welders time and expense. Besides I will still be using the Monte Carlo bar & the Export Brace.

 

I just read on the internet that Ford original had only one brace on the outside of the shock tower and the reinforcement is only used to stop the twist and flex of unsupportedshock towers. In my case mine are supported.

 

What do you think?

[1969_Mach1 333]

Have all the pieces installed.  The cost difference will be minimal.  Do the subframe connectors at a later time if needed.  Plus why second guess if it's as good as it could/should be.  That one brace you are referring to is also described in the Boss 302 Chassis Modification manual from the early 1970's.  That one brace placement was discovered long before shock tower fatigue cracking was an issue.  Like I mentioned, have whatever steering box you want to use installed so any issues can be sorted out at the time of the installation.

 

You can save some labor cost by fitting the pieces and prepping (removing paint) the weld surfaces yourself.  It does take some effort to fit all the pieces into place.  Get everything setup so the welder only has to set them in place and weld.    At that point I'd guess maybe 3 hours of weld time.  The weld sequence is spelled out in the instructions as well.

[prayers1 153]

Understood!

 

Thanks all for your opinions and help!!

[Rsanter 152]

First off where do you live? There may be a local member that can help.

 

Second, I hear you are not track racing the car so what is the plan for the car? Drag racing? Cruzing?

Drag racing will put a lot of stress on the front of the car, not as much as road racing will but the launches as well as when the car comes back down will stress the car.

You live in a rural area? How rough are the roads? That can add some stress to the car verses a nice paved freeway.

 

IMO, you at minimim should have the montecarlo bar and export brace.

The next step up will be the TA brace welded inside the tower.

The third will be the stitch welding

 

If you do the stitch welding, you do not need to add all that extra crap metal from the patch/reinforcement kits. Your towers are not broken so tying the layers together by welding will be fine for what you need

 

So, for where the header is hitting.

That is likly,the fault of the header design or something is off with the engine because of the mounts.

I suspect the header

Options. Cut and modify that specific header tube to better clear your car.

Or move the engine back a little. Sounds hard but it is not. Make a spacer that goes between the engine frame mount and the tower and install on the back side. A spacer of 1/4" may be all the is needed to get the clearance you need but only you or someone looking there at the car can determine that

Pbob

[LSG 15]

 Prayers, it sounds like you have chosen to add the reinforcements. I would if we were talking about my car, and I was going to add the power you are planning on. You'll be glad you did. On SFC, the only option ones I would consider are Tin Man's or make your own like Bucky D has done (awesome ). All of the bolt on / weld on ones other than those look cheesy. The convertible inner rails are probably stronger anyway. And those will be invisible.  LSG 

[prayers1 153]

Rsanter- To answer a few questions,

I already had been using the Monte Carlo Bar and Export Brace.  That is why I question if it is necessary to weld all of the pieces that come with the kit. I have good shock towers and no cracks plus I will be installing the Tin Man Sub frame connector at a later time.  Installing the reinforcement kit would be just an insurance measure.

 

I know of  a guy who has a similar build with the Tim Man SFC, he has no shock tower reinforcement and hasn't developed any cracks.

I know of another guy who has a Cougar with more torque in his motor, he races all the time w/o shock tower reinforcements but uses Tin Man SFC.

 

The car will see some street racing, I never back down from a race and mostly cruising and car shows

Header is close because the motor is shifted more to that one side, I'll be getting Ron Morris Motor Mounts.

 

What is a TA brace?

I don't know what stitch welding?

 

Here's a nice little video about the BOSS 302 Chassis Mod done by West Coast Classic Cougar

 

 

[lanky 44]

When I did my outer tower braces, I too had a mobile welder come out. He did an extraordinary job with the welding, but the prep work was all me. He even gave me a discount because when people usually say prep work done he finds that it is not, but it my case it was. 

[1969_Mach1 333]

Very confusing thread.  First, install shock tower reinforcements, then maybe convince yourself they will offer no benefit because there is a Monte Carlo bar, export brace, and in the future, subframe connectors.  Pick a path and follow it through to the end.  Anyway, that is not my decision.  Regardless of what is decided, at least install the better design export brace and a good Monte Carlo Bar.  The better designed export braces are copies of the original, thicker material, deeper more vertical profile shape.

[ray1970 88]

I have done all the above mods over the last 30 years but mine was a rust bucket and flexed a lot.

The sub-frame connters i found the biggest bang for the buck.(Tin mans) 

There all worth doing if you have the time.

[Mach1 Driver 560]

Hey John, that's a nice video. I think the TA brace you asked about is a Trans-Am brace which is the plate shown in #26 and also in the video.

[prayers1 153]

Sorry if it seems I'm riding the edge on this one.  I'm just having a hard time convincing myself to do the complete shock tower reinforcement, it's just so involved.

I know the benefits of the completed project but I keep telling myself that in my case its more of an overkill.  IMO, the reinforcement is for repairing cracked shock towers and if mine are good w/ the addition of the Monte Carlo Bar & Export Brace I shouldn't have any flex.  Sometimes I think we over kill these projects installing things not needed.

 

Plus with a Cleveland, there isn't much room between the shock tower and exhaust. I don't have tiny hands, so pulling plugs & putting spark plug wires on was always a Pain.

 

Sorry for taking you guys down this road, but this is why I asked for feedback, it's just one of those decisions I'm struggling with besides upgrading PS / PB's and a new motor build...............

 

Yeah Mach1 Driver, after watching the same video it dawned on my what TA meant.

[Max Power 74]

Why get ten feet from the finish line and stop? It's a bitch to get the car disassembled to the point where you can do all of this, why not see it through? What a crazy place to save a few bucks by not installing the last couple pieces. I think you are really over thinking this. If you are going to do it, do it. If not, don't.

[LoneWolf2U 136]

So your towers are in good shape, Then weld them up for insurance so they stay that way.

You can massage the lower end to allow for header clearance where it hits.

Sometimes keeping it simple is the best way!

[1969_Mach1 333]

IMO, the reinforcement is for repairing cracked shock towers and if mine are good w/ the addition of the Monte Carlo Bar & Export Brace I shouldn't have any flex. 

 

The reinforcement kit is also to prevent cracks from occurring.  It has so many pieces in the kit because the shock towers crack in many locations not only close to the bottom where the diagonal brace to the frame reinforces.  I've seen them basically shattered throughout the mid section.  If you've ever needed to replace shock towers, you'd be grateful for the reinforcement plates.  Plus, once they crack, it is from fatigue and the material starts to become brittle.  Unless it's one or two small cracks, most people replace the shock towers.  At that point, if you cannot weld, it's going to cost a lot of money to have them replaced, or it's time to invest in welding equipment and learn.

 

Back when replacement shock towers were not available, the most common repair was to weld the cracks.  If you have ever welded shock tower cracks as a repair, you'll realize that shortly after cracks will begin in other locations.  In my opinion, once they start cracking, they are pretty much finished. 

 

The shock towers on my Mach 1 were destroyed throughout the mid section.  Some cracks had been welded then others occurred.  The guy that did the body work also replaced the shock towers.  But, I had to source some used OEM shock towers because repro's were not yet available.  I was more than happy to also have a reinforcement kit installed on the new (used OEM) shock towers.  I also have Global West's Monte Carlo bar and the high quality repro Export Brace installed.  In my opinion those are mainly to improve handling and maintain front end geometry, and not intended to prevent shock tower cracking.

 

Ultimately it's your car and your decision.  These are my thoughts based on my experiences.

[Rsanter 152]

Rsanter- To answer a few questions,

I already had been using the Monte Carlo Bar and Export Brace.  That is why I question if it is necessary to weld all of the pieces that come with the kit. I have good shock towers and no cracks plus I will be installing the Tin Man Sub frame connector at a later time.  Installing the reinforcement kit would be just an insurance measure.

 

I know of  a guy who has a similar build with the Tim Man SFC, he has no shock tower reinforcement and hasn't developed any cracks.

I know of another guy who has a Cougar with more torque in his motor, he races all the time w/o shock tower reinforcements but uses Tin Man SFC.

 

The car will see some street racing, I never back down from a race and mostly cruising and car shows

Header is close because the motor is shifted more to that one side, I'll be getting Ron Morris Motor Mounts.

 

What is a TA brace?

I don't know what stitch welding?

 

Here's a nice little video about the BOSS 302 Chassis Mod done by West Coast Classic Cougar

 

The fact that your towers are in good shape is a good thing. You are lucky that is the case.

Often what breaks or separates the towers are the stress caused from flexing and in some areas rust can weaken the towers which can lead to premature cracking.

Stitch welding is the process of welding up the seams between the layers of materials that make up the towers. Stitch welding would be to weld an inch, skip and inch, weld an inch, skip an inch.

This is what was specified in the boss302 chassis guide. You have the option to also just do a full weld.

The TA brace or plate is also specified in the boss302 chassis guide and is pictured in post 26. That is the brace that goes on the inside of the towers under the control arms. This brace reduces stress and flexing in the tower by connecting/triangulating a point near where you bolt the upper arms on to a point at the outer edge of the frame rail. What is nice about this mod is that it is mostly invisible.

 

Welding up the towers is a good thing in a performance car but is very hard to undo if the car will ever be restored to original. The TA brace could be removed or left in place and most people will never see it should you ever restore the car. Part of the choices you need to make.

 

Yes you can do no added bracing and yes you may be fine. But if something does break then you are pulling the engine again to properly fix it. Again a personal choice. A little added bracing will also stiffen the chassis so it will allow a more consistent reaction from the suspension. Anytime the tires flex or the chassis moves, it is included as part of the reaction that the suspension/car takes to the curves and bumps. Most racers prefer a stiff chassis and a suspension that they can dial in the amount of movement or give because it makes for a more consistent reaction the car takes to what you are doing. Again a personal choice based on what you want out of the car

 

Bob

[prayers1 153]

If I bought this welder, would it do the job?

MIG Welder 110VAC/ 135A Output
Item #12011 Brand: Eastwood

Or does it need to be stick welded?

[1969_Mach1 333]

For that application, a Mig welder is best suited.  Stick welding is more difficult on thinner materials.  If you haven't had any experience stick welding, it's not best to learn on thinner materials.  Based on the amperage rating of the welder you purchased, it seems like it should weld material thickness you are working with.  If the welder has a short duty cycle you won't be able to run it continuously as long as more expensive welders.

[RPM 1,190]

Make sure you practice to you get good beads and penetrating including plug/rosette welds. Use sheet metal coupons about 2"x 6" of the thickness you'll be working on your car. Learning on a project is not a good idea.

[Mach1 Driver 560]

Prayers, I've been looking at welders too and don't usually find good things to say about Eastwood:

This from The Garage Journal, Re: Eastwood MIG Welder 135 Amp Item #12011

I bought an Eastwood with the idea of "Teaching myself how to weld" I wasn't at all happy with it. It wasn't this exact model, it was a 220 Volt machine. The build quality wasn't great and performance was pretty poor. Erratic wire feed speed, ground clamp was pretty week and the gun just felt pretty cheap in my hand.

What I thought was just my inability to weld and inexperience was proven wrong when a good friend who is an experienced welder broke a bracket on his utility trailer while at my house and he attempted to use my welder to fix it. He had a hard time just geting a quality weld with it.

I will say that Eastwoods "No Hassle" return policy was exactly that. They took it back with me only saying I didn't like it. 

I bought a Miller 190 and found out that you do actually get what you pay for. If you can wait until you can afford to spend more I would strongly suggest waiting and buying a higher quality welder.

 

 

Many people rate these as best: Miller, Lincoln, ESAB, Hobart (and from the price its easy to say you get what you pay for).

[ray1970 88]

I stick welded mine but at that time im not shore they had Mig welders..

 

The stick welder is long gone and now have a snap-on 110 mig...... paid 1200.00$ for it 23 years ago..

[prayers1 153]

Thanks Mach1 Driver for that insight. It may be cheaper to have someone just weld it.  I'm thinking, how often will I be using a welder?

[3pedal 95]

John, I have the Eastwood 135 its ok, just ok ...has been replaced once by Eastwood and parts replaced since...hmmmmm...its ok for sheetmetal ...worked well on the Tin Man subframe connectors...would definitely spend twice on a better mig.

[schweigert 13]

can anyone recommend a good monte carlo bar? 

[Midlife 814]

can anyone recommend a good monte carlo bar?

Yes...there's this nice little bar in Monaco: Bar Du Quai.

https://www.google.co.uk/maps/place/Quai+des+Artistes/@43.7325299,7.4237902,15z/data=!4m5!3m4!1s0x0:0xc048f0c57c7f0282!8m2!3d43.7325299!4d7.4237902

[Vicfreg 771]

LatoRacing is going to wrap my shock towers and put the small reinforcing plates on the outside of the shock towers.  I have a Convertible, and will need all the help I can get to stiffen the Unibody.  I also have some subframe connectors going in. I will run a pretty hot 393 stroker in my 'Vert.