Fuel Neck Filler Mods?

[stangs-R-me 120]

3 hours ago, unilec said:

Is this the same as the one listed here, just thinking it would be good to upgrade my 65 to see what I need to change for my 69.

http://www.capsnecks.com/j1114_solutions.htm

Interesting ... two basic variations (only difference is inside I.D. of 1.7 or 1.6") and either plain or galvanized.   The one on the other site is the 1.7" dia. version Galvanized.    Since I plan on plating the whole assembly afterwards, maybe getting the un-galvanized version would be the way to go.   However I don't see where / how you can actually order them from this site other than calling them.

Doug

[stangs-R-me 120]

OK, googled NJ-507090-2 and their STORE popped up ...

http://www.capsnecks.com/store/nj-507090-2

... however this is the only version that comes up in the capsnecks store and interestingly the -G2 version is the only type available on the fillernecksupply.com web site (but currently on back order).

UPDATE:

Tried to order a couple of these today and you can put them in a cart, but I don't see how to access the cart or check out.   I then clicked on their Terms of Sale and it states ...

MINIMUM ORDERS.
Unless expressly waived in a written quote, a surcharge of $100 (75 €/60 £) will be applied to orders below $750 (500 €/400 £). In addition, any product-specific minimum order quantities shall be specified in a written quote.

So, looks like back to square one waiting on the other site to get them back in stock.

Doug

[stangs-R-me 120]

Ordered the more $$ Scott Drake filler neck and disappointingly, it is the EXACT SAME neck CJP sells ... just put in a bag with a Scott Drake part number sticker.   MFG date is 2016 vs 2017 for the CJP neck ... lower price moves faster I guess.   And like the CJP neck, no vent dent in the face.

Bought the SD version from Summit Racing and since they supply return labels with their stuff I'll be sending it back.   Had it had the vent dent, I'd of kept it.

Doug

 

[stangs-R-me 120]

On ‎11‎/‎19‎/‎2017 at 8:05 AM, stangs-R-me said:

OK, googled NJ-507090-2 and their STORE popped up ...

http://www.capsnecks.com/store/nj-507090-2

... however this is the only version that comes up in the capsnecks store and interestingly the -G2 version is the only type available on the fillernecksupply.com web site (but currently on back order).

UPDATE:

Tried to order a couple of these today and you can put them in a cart, but I don't see how to access the cart or check out.   I then clicked on their Terms of Sale and it states ...

MINIMUM ORDERS.
Unless expressly waived in a written quote, a surcharge of $100 (75 €/60 £) will be applied to orders below $750 (500 €/400 £). In addition, any product-specific minimum order quantities shall be specified in a written quote.

So, looks like back to square one waiting on the other site to get them back in stock.

Doug

Just checked and YES ... the "NJ507090G2" is still out of stock at fillernecksupply.com.

Doug

[TexasEd 188]

I just installed the filler neck I ordered several years ago and it does have the vent dent.

I went back and I ordered the neck in 2012 and it was CJPP part # FFP3.  The current picture shows it without the dent.  I guess it would not be too hard to make the dent.

Is there a place to get a replacement rubber seal for the back of the gas cap?

 

[stangs-R-me 120]

Interesting Ed ... the one Mach1 Driver used in his modification a while back also had the dent and it came from CJP as well.   They either switched vendors, or the vendor either eliminated it or forgot to do in on more recent batches ... at least ways in the 2016 & 2017 batches that the two I bought came from.

Just checked the Filler Neck Supply website and the inserts are again BACK IN STOCK ... so I ordered two.   

Doug

 

 

[Mike65 475]

Do you have a part # for the one you ordered?.

[stangs-R-me 120]

3 hours ago, Mike65 said:

Do you have a part # for the one you ordered?.

NJ507090G2  ... at fillernecksupply.com

Doug

 

[Mike65 475]

Thanks Doug.

[unilec 57]

Good to know their back in stock, let us know how good the fitment is. I will have to send them an email to see if they post to Aussie.

[stangs-R-me 120]

Got the filler neck inserts in the mail last Friday and had a chance to play with one of them today here at work.

At first I talked about in-brazing the filler neck from the flange so I could slip the insert in from the top then re-braze it back up.   This would have required re-plating once it was all done so I thought I'd experiment with getting it to slip in from the bottom.

I was planning on using the hydraulic hose crimper at work to reduce the flange down so it could slip in the top, why not just crimp it a bit further so it could slip in from the bottom and around the bend ??

I'd of filler neck tube is about 2.150" so I started there and slowly crimped it further until I could tap it in around the bend.   Final crimp was about 2.093" and I tweaked the top and bottom a bit more with a hammer to around 2.070".

Added some 1/8 x 1/2" adhesive backed gasketing just beyond the flange so it is currently a friction fit.   This way I can take it to a gas station and can still move it in or out to find the perfect spot with a nozzle inserted.   I've got it basically in the spot per Mach1 Driver's drawing right now, but it just looks "TOO FAR IN" to me.

Once I've got the desired spot, I'll drill 4 small holes that line up with the flange, re-insert and tack weld the insert flange to tube welding the small holes shut at the same time.   This small amount of welding should not require having this whole thing re-plated keeping this mod ultra simple (provided you can find some way to crimp down the insert OD).

1st pic is the insert with it's flange crimped to 2.093"

2nd is the hose crimper I used

3rd is the insert in a completely un-modified CJP # FFP3 filler pipe / neck ... approximately at the location per Mach1 Driver's drawing:  

 

[Mach1 Driver 560]

I set the position using a CAD cross section with the nozzle inserted. I tried to position it so that wall splash would not turn off the pump. I'm sure we will all benefit from your experimentation. Looking forward to your solution.

[stangs-R-me 120]

I know you went to great lengths figuring all this out and drawing it up which in your case was more or less so you knew where to CUT it since going your route is basically a 1 shot deal per neck.   The engineer in me greatly appreciates your engineering !!   

I definitely want the nozzle to go in as far as possible like your drawing shows, and your location could very well be the perfect spot.   But figured since I've got this friction-fit thing going I may as well test fit it on a couple of nozzles before marking, drilling, & welding my version.   Since I bought 2 inserts, I was certainly prepared to mess up the first one ... but at $16.20 per insert delivered, I'd rather get it right the 1st time and still have a spare one to mod for someone else !!

Doug 

[TexasEd 188]

I have an extra original neck I replaced.  Most of the coating is gone on it already.

If it helps I would be willing to donate to the cause.

 

Let me know and I can ship it.

[stangs-R-me 120]

10 hours ago, TexasEd said:

I have an extra original neck I replaced.  Most of the coating is gone on it already.

If it helps I would be willing to donate to the cause.

 

Let me know and I can ship it.

I've also got my original neck still in the car too.   Not at the point yet that I'm looking for extras, but if I get there at some point I'll let you know ... certainly appreciate the offer.

As my mind is in constant motion, I thought of a possible no-weld solution.   Add a few dimples on either side of the insert with a center punch to retain the location then add some JB Weld between the insert & tube to further retain it and keep it from turning.   If the JB weld fails, the dimples would then keep it from sliding down the tube and dropping into the tank.

Doug

    

[stangs-R-me 120]

OK guys it is DONE and the staking worked wonderfully and is retaining it and even keeping it from turning.   Much better than I expected that I'm confident enough to say JB weld will NOT be necessary.   Extremely happy with the results ... lots of pictures:

[stangs-R-me 120]

I was also able to easily duplicate the "VENT DENT" using a 1/4" 12MM deep socket and a ball been hammer on my B&D Workmate ... looks almost O.E.:

 

[stangs-R-me 120]

My local service station had a brand new spare nozzle on hand that they let me borrow, so I could verify the positioning of the insert was good before staking it in place.   This was much better than standing out in the cold and playing with a nozzle attached to a pump !!

 

[Mach1 Driver 560]

Very neat and clean, and an elegant solution. Since hardly anyone will have access to a  hydraulic hose crimper, I wonder if the flange on the insert could be massaged down manually? Maybe support the inside of the insert on a curved surface and place an appropriate thickness of curved sheet metal on the outside surface as a spacer and then tap the flange down to the temporary spacer. The internal gas cap threads in the insert make it difficult to support that way. Hmmm. Anyway, nice job. 

[stangs-R-me 120]

In conclusion, I'm really glad this worked out the way it did ... could not be happier with the results.

Not having to "un-braze" the flange off to slip the insert in from the top saved having to re-plate the thing when done.   Looking at this thing it cocks a bit to the left, so it might have also been difficult to braze it back exactly where it was without some sort of fixture.   

Staking it in place was also much better than drilling holes for welding it in place.   If the welds would have been ugly (typical of mine) and required a little grinding this would have disturbed the plating as well.   Also did not need to be concerned with my welds being "leak-tight".   Since I just staked it on the sides & bottom the most noticeable top surface of the neck is blemish free.   I did not avoid the top side for appearance reasons, it was due to the bend and how to retain the neck in order to get stakes there.   

Used my original hose clamps on the new repro Autolite hose.   This hose is nothing like my original, but is a much better hose for this application.   It has a fiber braid in it that the OE hose appears to not have and has a rough wrapped exterior where the original is completely smooth and void of ANY markings.   It is also thicker than the O.E. hose ... I almost could not get the old clamp screw threads to catch !! 

[stangs-R-me 120]

4 minutes ago, Mach1 Driver said:

Very neat and clean, and an elegant solution. Since hardly anyone will have access to a  hydraulic hose crimper, I wonder if the flange on the insert could be massaged down manually? Maybe support the inside of the insert on a curved surface and place an appropriate thickness of curved sheet metal on the outside surface as a spacer and then tap the flange down to the temporary spacer. The internal gas cap threads in the insert make it difficult to support that way. Hmmm. Anyway, nice job. 

Possibly, but I guess it would be very time consuming.

Many full line Auto Parts stores can make hydraulic hoses and the die set I used is for 1" hose which most crimping machines go up to.   I would think that an Exhaust Shop would have crimp dies that could do the job as well.

Doug

[Shep69 149]

You Da Man  stangs r me. 

Last time I filled up the tank the fuel kept getting an air lock and blowing back out . Pissing me off.

Great solution. 

[MN69Grande 203]

This is awesome!  Great work.  I think this will go on next years mod lists as this winter already has more than I can get done!

[RPM 1,190]

Very nice work there stangs-R-me!

[stangs-R-me 120]

Now, I'm not really interested in selling finished necks with insert installed as there is a bit of labor involved and I'd also have to buy the necks which are different for '69 & 70 as well '65-66 & '67-68.   But since I have a hose crimper at my disposal (that the average person does not), I would be willing to buy these inserts in bulk and crimp them down for you guys.

Other issue of finished necks is gas pump nozzles may not be the same in all 50 states / worldwide, so the position of the insert may have to be adjusted.    Back 10-20 years ago, some stations in the Midwest (and probably elsewhere) had nozzles with a rubber accordion boot on the end that captured the fumes as they exited the tank.   With this style nozzle, the insert would need to be closer to the top, if not right at the top like a modern car.

Marking the location with a tape measure & sharpie marker and staking it in with a hammer & center punch is something ANYBODY can do on the edge of a workbench.   It also takes the liability off of me were I to sell a finished product that is associated with one of Ford's better ideas of a fuel tank installation that is basically the same configuration as the famous "Tap-Boom Pinto".   This could very well be why none of the Mustang parts vendors are already selling something like this.  

I did test fit my crimped insert into my O.E. neck and it went in easier than the repro, so I'd guess it should fit into any O.E. or repro '65 to 70 neck.   I'm sure tolerances can vary though so if too tight, some light massaging with a hammer around the outside till it slips in past the elbow or if too loose prying the crimped flange in a few spots would tighten it up.

The cost of getting one of these INSERTS delivered to your door (48 states) from fillernecksupply is $19.45 via 1st class mail.  

If I were to offer a crimped one ready to slip in for $29.00 delivered 1st class mail could I get 10 or more people interested ??   Those outside the 48 states I would need to check postage and as far as outside the U.S. you would need to use a forwarder.   If you wanted more than one, I would offer a price break due to postage savings.

Anyone interested send me a PM.

Doug