IFS suspensions

[metalgraver 12]

Any body put an Independent front suspension in their 69? such as what Rod & Custom or Heidts sells. I need to rebuild the whole front suspension and after looking at all new stock parts and disk brakes, I will spend almost as much on that or the coil overs as a complete IFS will cost. The added benefit with the IFS is the rack and pinion steering. Not sure though. I want a lower stance than stock and really nice handling for the street and hwy. Let me know what you guys have and some pics of that low ride.

[barnett468 418]

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you dont need to spend a lot to get xlnt handling on the street . . the stock suspension arms arre plenty good enough . . the tubular arms are nice and look flashy but really are overkill unless you auto cross or road race . . a good budget set up is moog or mcquay arms and tie rod ends etc . . .a bearing type idler arm ids nice but this will reduce the auto return to center feel which bothers some people including me, but you can add a bit more positive castor to compensate for it . . scott drake urethane spring perches or nice . . roller perches are nicer but pricey . . tcp strud rod bushings . .480 or 520 lowering springs . . ride height can be adjusted with different height spacers . . the 620 springs are pretty stiff especially when combined with stiff shocks and big sway bar . . 15/16 or 1 inch front sway bar . . anything bigger is pretty stout . . white or back kyb shocks, better ones are konis or vikings with damping control knobs , . strut susp doesn't improve performance a lot but it does make it easier to adjust ride height . . for rear springs just get reverse eye 145 lb from tcp or detroit eaton etc . . anything heavier here will also start to feel fretty firm . . lower the upper front arm mounting position 1 inch same as 65-66 shelby . . you can add delrin front bushings in the leaf spring bushings to reduce body sway in the rear or a watts link to totally eliminate it, but it increases ride harshness . . look online at abs power brake supply in calif for brake kits . . alignmrent try point 3 negative camber [not 3] . . 2.0 positive caster . . 3/16 toe in . . this entire set up will handle xlnt but will increase ride firmness noticeably but will not be extremely firm or harsh

 

post addition

 

if you just want a noticeable improvement but prefer the ride to be a bit more soft than harsh and don't plan on super 'hard cornering or dont plsan on driving like andy granatelli, i would do the following:

 

optional - lower front 1", this make a noticeable improvement in steering in the corners . . it makes it turn a bit tighter.

 

480 springs . . the stockers are around 210 so these are more than twice as stiff.

 

135 lb rear springs . . stockers are around 110.

 

kyb front shocks or the adjustable konis or vikings . . the vikings have both adjustable compression and rebound knobs but they are 190.00 each.

 

tcp strut bushings

 

15/16 front sway bar . . 1" if it is a big block.

 

i hate racks on a non rack mustang . . the stock steering works just as well in proper condition.

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[1969_Mach1 333]

I agree with barnett468.  The stock suspension and steering will go a long way.  Look back at all the road racing that use to be done by reworking stock suspension components.  Look at your budget and what the whole car needs before spending a lot just on suspension components.

[Jimjific 23]

Go with a rack setup and you will never want to own another Mustang without one. I have a rack, coil overs, jointed strut rods, a STRAIGHT Monty Carlo bar tied into the shock towers and a 1" sway bar. This has given me the best handling Mustang I've ever had.

 

Jim

[Ridge Runner 1,112]

I went with an Aero Form coil over kit ,bolts right in and fully adjustable ,looks the same as TCP. Also used a Borgeson stearing kit, No mods were needed ,it all  bolts in place .

[Rsanter 152]

The stock front suspension IS and IFS

 

Bob

[shaun071 62]

I agree with the guys that upgrading the stock suspension is a better option unless you are really serious about autocross etc. you would be surprised just how good the stock suspension can be with the right improvements. People seem to spend alot of money making changes just because it is better in theory due to newer design etc but if you aren't getting serious about racing etc is it cost effective? My car has lowered springs, poly bushes throughout, 1" front sway bar, KYB shocks, new everything basically. I've modified the coupe in a similar manner to the Aussie Falcons I've owned which use the same suspension system. I've been more than happy with the results for daily driving and the odd autocross.

[SM69Mach 68]

Good news is there are a lot of options for suspension out there for these cars, but that is also the bad news..as it can become overwhelming. 

 

I agree with above that while the stock stuff can be made to work well but there are certainly improvements to be made.  I would suggest calling some different companies and talking to them about your options.  I bought my stuff from Shaun and Street or Track so he would be my personal suggestion to talk with.  We talked a few times about my options, budget and use of the car before I bought my set up and I could not be happier.

 

I know other folks have used Open Tracker, Maier, and Global West all with great results as well. 

 

Do as much research as you can for what you plan to do with the car.  Good Luck

[1969_Mach1 333]

I still prefer working with the OEM suspension and steering, but that's just me and my old school mind set.  I would like to put in my 2 cents regarding aftermarket coil over and rack and pinion systems.  Most of them look nice, but I don't follow that stuff closely.  As a Mechanical Engineer I always wonder how many of those components went through any engineering analysis (not simply CAD modeling), or were they created by automotive fabricators with good fabrication and welding skills.  I have seen some with every component adjustable which indicates to me very little to no engineering was involved.

[metalgraver 12]

Thanks for all the input. I have looked at almost everything out there from just a simple rebuild of existing components, replacing the springs, 1" Shelby drop, roller perches etc. to the full IFS kits with racket pinion. For a  little more money I think Iam leaning towards the Rod & custom RC-107 set up, full adjustable coil overs with the rack and pinion steering. Of all the things that can be upgraded I think that the handling and steering is the most important, but that's my opinion. I want a car that I can drive for 4 hours and enjoy the ride and when I get to where Iam going I do not want to feel like I just wrestled a bear for 4 hours. My wife wants to drive the car also so this will make it more enjoyable for her. It is more expensive but I do not want to sacrifice enjoyment for a few dollars. Any body else have the rack and pinion steering?

[Rsanter 152]

So you are saying upgrade? You have to ask if the mustang II suspension geometry is an upgrade? Is it better? How many race cars or track cars use that suspension to improve the handling if their mustang?

 

Bob

[metalgraver 12]

So you are saying upgrade? You have to ask if the mustang II suspension geometry is an upgrade? Is it better? How many race cars or track cars use that suspension to improve the handling if their mustang?

 

Bob

Bob, Iam saying that after spending a lot of time researching the different options out there and the costs, I have decided to go ahead and spend a few more dollars to get the best ride I can. Of coarse this is just for the front, there is also the rear end that needs to be addressed. I think it all comes down to what you really want and how much you have to spend. My opinion.

[Jimjific 23]

I'm all for rack and pinions since they are far superior than a worm gear box, but I would think for ~$3k and the non ease of this install you could probably do it easier and save some money with other systems. Plus remember that their system still needs to be upgraded to make it a power rack. I'm not knocking their system since it is probably very good when finished. It just seems too involved for me. If you get one, keep us informed on how it all goes.

 

Jim

[barnett468 418]

Bob, Iam saying that after spending a lot of time researching the different options out there and the costs, I have decided to go ahead and spend a few more dollars to get the best ride I can. Of coarse this is just for the front, there is also the rear end that needs to be addressed. I think it all comes down to what you really want and how much you have to spend. My opinion.

the mustang II system will NOT give you a better "ride" in any way shape or form . . it simply will not happen.

[barnett468 418]

I want a car that I can drive for 4 hours and enjoy the ride and when I get to where Iam going I do not want to feel like I just wrestled a bear for 4 hours. My wife wants to drive the car also so this will make it more enjoyable for her. It is more expensive but I do not want to sacrifice enjoyment for a few dollars. Any body else have the rack and pinion steering?

neither the mustang II system nor a rack and pinion will reduce the steering effort . . shocks and springs have nothing to do with steering effort.

 

you can't easily do a shelby drop on a mustang II set up.

[1969_Mach1 333]

I tend to agree with barnett468 on this topic.  I've been around these Mustangs long before aftermarket suspensions were available and appreciate them for what they are.  I am fine with modifying the original suspensions.  But many people prefer newer technology suspensions on these older cars.  For me, completely changing suspension systems takes away too much original character of these cars. 

[RogerC 136]

These are all better systems than R&C IMO. While some don't include a rack you can source a good one elsewhere.

http://www.globalwest.net/comnr-6770d.html

http://www.globalwest.net/comnr-6770bs.html

http://www.streetortrack.com/Street-or-Track-Front-Coilover-System-pr-24491.html

http://martzchassis.net/products/front-independent-suspension/1965-68-1969-72-mustang-suspension-systems/

https://www.cachassisworks.com/p-2342-mustang-64-73-fordmercury-60-77-front-coil-over-conversion-system.aspx

https://www.cachassisworks.com/Attachments/Catalogs/BG_300.pdf - Go to page 18

[barnett468 418]

when I get to where Iam going I do not want to feel like I just wrestled a bear for 4 hours. My wife wants to drive the car also so this will make it more enjoyable for her. It is more expensive but I do not want to sacrifice enjoyment for a few dollars. Any body else have the rack and pinion steering?

 

rack and pinion does NOT reduce steering effort by much if at all . . if you want to reduce the steering effort, you need to change the steering ratios or add a power steering unit or run skinnier tires.

 

borgeson has a simple bolt in ps unit but you need to increase your caster to around 2 - 2.5 degrees to increase the "return to center" feel in the steering wheel that is reduced by this set up.

 

 

mustang std . . 19:1 = 4 5/8 turns

 

mustang opt . . 16:1 = 3 3/4 turns

 

mustang ps . . . 16:1 = 3 3/4 turns

 

borgeson . . . . .16:1 = 3 3/4 turns

 

http://www.cjponyparts.com/borgeson-power-steering-upgrade-kit-289-302-351w-1968-1970/p/PSK16/?utm_source=google&utm_medium=merchant&utm_campaign=shopping&gclid=CL3iwsSrpsMCFQsFaQodbJ8A9g

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[mustangstofear 608]

This is what we make and install. We are now starting to make it for those that want to use their factory frame rails and not our full frame assy. We've also changed the design of how the upper control arm bolts on. It dosen't have slots like Rod and Custom, bur uses regular shims. I'll have pictures of the new design next week

http://www.mustangstofear.com/page.php?page=parts_catalog&yr=67-68&cat=suspension&scat=front_subframes∏=short_front_subframe_assembly

[barnett468 418]

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the main reasons people say that a strut rod suspension or rack and pinion works way better on their mustang than a std suspension or steering is because they are replacing old worn out parts with new ones and most struts come with decent shocks [because aftermarket struts do not come with cr_ppy shocks for an early mustang] and some struts come with progressive rate coil springs . . the strut design does not change the leverage of the front suspension a lot either.

 

You can get the same exact ride buy buying good shocks like kyb white [if you are on a budget], koni’s or Vikings which are an improved version of the qa-1 shocks so perhaps they fixed the notorious leak problem that the qa-1’s have/had.

 

There are at least two mfgs for progressive rate springs if you want them plus eibach will make anything you want.

 

A shelby drop car will out turn a mustang II steering any day of the week.

 

They raced this old school suspension at 160 mph in the old days . . worked just fine then so it seems to me it will still work just fine at 70.

 

 

Here’s another good shock option

 

http://www.strangeengineering.net/high-performance-street/shocks-struts-springs/ford-bolt-in-shocks-struts/64-73-mustang-front-double-adj-shock-ea.html

 

 

http://www.strangeengineering.net/media/catalog/product/cache/1/small_image/252x252/9df78eab33525d08d6e5fb8d27136e95/s/5/s5045-1_2.jpg

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[Rsanter 152]

Bob, Iam saying that after spending a lot of time researching the different options out there and the costs, I have decided to go ahead and spend a few more dollars to get the best ride I can. Of coarse this is just for the front, there is also the rear end that needs to be addressed. I think it all comes down to what you really want and how much you have to spend. My opinion.

And what I am saying is that installing a mustang II suspension conversion will no improve the handling or the ride quality of your car over what you can do with the stock geometry suspension.

 

My 66 conv has the shelby drop plus the variable rate springs. It handles good enough to do well in auto cross and it rides nice on the road

 

My 69 conv has stock geometry suspension and variable rate springs plus I have added the CPP integral steering box. The car rides nice but it is far from the ride of a Lexus or some luxo car.

 

Bob

[RPM 1,190]

Opentracker has some nice products, and especially Dan @ Chockostang.

[stick 10]

Probably your best bet would be to ride and drive an old mustang with stock suspension then drive and ride one with rebuilt stock style suspension then ride and drive one with must2 style or ifs style. Then make your choice, thats what I did.

[Ridge Runner 1,112]

I drove a Mustang with the mustang II front end and didn't really care for it .When it is all said and done it is still just a pinto front end ,although fancier ,and a lot more expensive .

Doing the 1 inch drop on the upper control arm changes the handling quite a bit .A good sway bar and set of shocks and a new spring saddle and it will handle great With the factory front suspension . I went with Aero forms kit on my 69,it is pretty much the same as TCP but cost a bit less .i cant wait to drive it ,it has to be a big improvement while still using the factory dimensions .

[sportsroof69 13]

What Mustang doesn't have IFS?