The cost of riding low...

[miketyler 15]

I have about 400 miles on my car now and personally for a 4 year journey I feel like I have arrived with the car. All the little bells and whistles I added along the way that I painstakingly obsessed over are all wrapped up to completion. The vision I had for the car is 100% achieved but while I love the car's stance and get lots of looks and thumbs up, admittedly the ride quality could be better.

 

In dropping the car I ran with the conventional advice and did the Arning drop and cut the front springs. On the rear, I consulted with Rick Flores and followed his direction with getting my stock springs de-arched 2" and added 2" blocks. Rick has his own website now here

http://www.rickfloresmotorsports.com/

 

Honestly, I could continue to drive the car like this but I think I may at some point want to improve on the ride quality. What are my options other than raising it back up?

 

Would Air-Ride Systems give me a smoother ride at lowered ride height? I could see the benefit of dialing in ride height on the fly. But maybe its a case where the higher you inflate the bags the smoother it gets and at lower ride heights its just as stiff as I have now? Also, would installing Air-Ride in the rear necessitate installation of a 4-link or some other type floating rear axle application?

 

Below is pictured from the day of the first drive, 4th of July 2013

[Brian Conway 264]

I honestly think the ride quality in these cars is poor, by today's standards, to begin with. The lower you go the worse it gets. Both of my cars, 65 and 69, are stock suspension cars, Arning on the 69, with Stiff KYB's. I feel every crack and bump in the road. Brian

[miketyler 15]

You make a good point but I have rode in a friends 70 Mach 1 and it is a night and day difference in ride quality. Compared to mine, his seems to "float" for lack of a better word. His has the high ground clearance that the car came with originally and is definitely an improvement over what I experience now. I should have mentioned I have new KYB GR2's all the way around.

 

Up front I don't think the shocks contribute to my problem as much as the cut springs do but am unsure. Running the shocks closer to bottom of their range probably isn't good either but I haven't had the opportunity to bottom one out yet.

[RPM 1,190]

When you cut coil springs the spring rate or stiffness is increased, resulting in a stiffer ride. I'm not familiar with the KYB's ride quality. Member Cruzzar has Air Ride on his 70.

 

Bob

[miketyler 15]

Yes, I had read that and was willing to make the sacrifice. I got the look I wanted but now wonder if I can have both. That's why I started the thread. Maybe a better title is "the tradeoffs of riding low"

 

Other questions on bagged options are do these cars become handling cars? Or are they really about adjustable ride height, looks and comfort? I would presume the latter.

[SM69Mach 68]

Mike

 

I feel your pain.

 

I had the same issue, but a little different. I was running 620lb spring, not cut (big block helped keep it low) and mid eye rears with 2 in lowering blocks, KYB gas shocks all around. Rode like crap, beat the hell out of me on every bump.I just made the switch to Street or track Coil over set up with Bilstens all the way around. I did raise the car up about 3/4 of an in but it still sits pretty low but the ride is SO MUCH better. Much easier to raise with the coil over setup, but well worth it to me.

[cavboy78 28]

Great looking stance! I'm working on getting that low, just not quite there yet.

 

I'm not the smartest suspension guy, but I feel if you are going to run that low, a coil over conversion in the front would help tremendously. Not only are you increasing your coil and shock length (which should improve ride quality), but there are a lot of options in coils once you go to that kind of set up. This includes rates, lengths, and ability to preload the coil. That coupled with a set of QA-1s that allow you to fine tune your compression and rebound should get you closer to what you want out of your ride. I just find that once you start deviating this much from the factory specs, factory hardware does not produce the desired outcome.

 

Rambling thougts from a mad man...

[Alan_Mac 48]

I have a fully adjustable TCP coilover conversion setup with quickset 2 shocks. Much more adjustable. I am not very knowledgeable on fine tuning the shock damping. I am still fooling with it to get the right damping balance between the front and back. The shocks have compression and rebound settings, I finally put to the same setting and that helped allot. I was on a mildly rough road yesterday, I am going to drop the setting 1 click.

[Bossed 10]

I have a fully adjustable TCP coilover conversion setup with quickset 2 shocks. Much more adjustable. I am not very knowledgeable on fine tuning the shock damping. I am still fooling with it to get the right damping balance between the front and back. The shocks have compression and rebound settings, I finally put to the same setting and that helped allot. I was on a mildly rough road yesterday, I am going to drop the setting 1 click.

 

Since this was posted back in July, have you found a "happy" setting ?

 

Bossed

[Happystang 10]

I always thought in stock form these cars had fairly decent ride quality. It was only until I started modifying the suspension that the ride quality became a little more harsh.

 

 

Still tolerable, but nowhere near stock feel. The 620 lowering springs are harsh as is. Cut them a bit and you should be calling a chiropractor:)

[SA69mach 39]

I think your suspension is perfect for different wheels.

Remember that apart from the cool 'look' of large wheels, they were a quick way to stiffen up the ride, increase road feel, and get a better feeling of instant response.

Sort of what you would do if you could not afford the time and expense of changing the suspension components.

You have done both, and the result is very stiff suspension feel, and very little damping from the road surface.

 

I would suggest Bilstein shocks all round. The KYB will not manage the changes you have made. They are a satisfactory shock to improve over stock set-up, not hi-po suspension and large wheels.

Combined with some more sidewall. Not sure exactly what you are running now, but the sidewall is a very good dampener. I am pretty sure you may not want to change your big wheels for smaller ones, but that is going to make your ride feel better, and still retain the performance advantages your suspension brings.

What wheels, tires, and brakes are you running now?

 

If you are willing to reduce wheel diameter and change the tire aspect, I am sure there are many options available, something with a cool look, great handling, and softer ride.

[MikeStang 247]

I feel your pain Brotha.

I'm running 620 drop coils with about 1/2 a coil cut and the Arning drop in the front along with a Reverse eye spring in the rear and KYB Shocks all the way around.

I recently loosened the front spring eyes and drove the car and tighten them back up with the weight of the car on the springs and the car settled about another 1/4" so Im now sitting past the tread on my 275/40/18s in the rear and need to cut some more coil to level the front end out.

The car rides smooth on the Interstate but when you do find the pot holes omg its painful.

Not to mention my rear shocks are now bent at the attaching points on the shock plates :/

[1969_Mach1 333]

First off, I'm sorry for sounding critical, but, the car is so low with a stock suspension that it may hitting the bump stops fairly often and large diameter wheels with short profile tires that the original suspension was never designed to work with. How can it not have a rough ride? In stock form, although too tall for most people including myself, these cars had a soft ride.

Edited December 1, 2014 by 1969_Mach1

[DarkBuddha 107]

Good point about the bump stops... I know when I just had spring clamps taking 1.5 coils worth out of my stock springs (I know, I know... not the best way to lower a car, but it totally worked for a really really long time) that I had to trim the bump stops to stop from hitting them on full compression in hard cornering.

 

I also agree that it's difficult to avoid a harsh(er) ride, especially once you start modifying them for more suspension performance. Big sway bars, higher rate springs, firmer dampers, poly bushings, low profile tires, less suspension travel, etc., all contribute. If you're willing to compromise here and there, you can probably find a setup that is tolerable and still handles decently. Let how you drive the car decide how it should be set up. If it's a cruiser and stance matters a lot, go with softer (stock?) spring rates and maybe drop spindles instead of high rate cut coils. Back down on the sway bar sizing a bit. Switch to a tire with a bit more sidewall and tires noted for their ride quality versus outright handling.

[1969_Mach1 333]

Well said DarkBuddha.

[MikeStang 247]

Whats a Bump Stop?

LMAO.

 

I don't have any bump stops on the car and have no signs of anything hitting anywhere LOL.

I just have a very firm ride....

[1969_Mach1 333]

Bump Stop: Rubber pad (if you will), one at each wheel attached to the car body or frame that the suspension hits when bottoming out preventing metal to metal contact between suspension and car body or frame. On Mustangs, in the front they are attached to the bottom of the coil spring outer covers and contact the upper control arms when bottoming out. In the back they are attached to the frame rails directly above the axle and contact the axle when bottoming out. In the back there is also a pinion snubber but that serves a different purpose.

[DarkBuddha 107]

I think he was being sarcastic... He probably needed to delete them entirely to get the car that low. I have admit I'm kinda bummed to hear the ride is that harsh, 'cause it sure does look good and I'd love to be able to go that low.

[1969_Mach1 333]

I thought so, but wasn't 100%. I wondered how could MikeStang not know what a bump stop is.

Edited December 1, 2014 by 1969_Mach1

[Cruzzar 22]

Having never had another mustang I have nothing to compare to. I had the complete air ride suspension on my '70 and found it to ride relatively smooth and slightly firm. It did translate road imperfections such as concrete joints and pot holes with a firm jolt. This is probably expected when you run a lower profile tire (245/40/18 & 275/40/18 on 18x8 and 18x10 rims). One advantage with the air ride is that the suspension bags work as a variable rate spring. At ride height it is a comfortable ride and as the suspension is compressed the theoretical spring rate increases as the air is compressed to the point I don't think I ever bottomed the suspension out. The instructions indicate that the car will set about 2 inches lower than stock after installing the package. I set my car a little lower than that (I believe). The distance from the floor to the top of the front wheel well lip was 24 3/4" (front) and 25 1/2" (back) when the car was at ride height. I really liked the option of raising the car when entering a parking lot or encountering a speed bump (never scraped the bottom in 5500 miles) while having a relative low driving stance.

[MikeStang 247]

yeah I was just messing around LOL...I know what a bump stop is but I don't have them on my car.

It seems I have plenty of room all the way around and have never bottomed out as far as I know and Im running the same Tire package as Cruzzar but non Air Bagged.

I am considering an air bag set up tho.

Would there be any advantage to removing the stock shocks and installing some coil overs on the rear axle?

There is a race shop near by that caters to dirt track and drag race guys, kinda like a Mini summitt racing and they have all kinds of brackets to weld to rear ends and also sale coil over shocks by AFCO and QA1 and the stuff is way cheaper than the box stores and I'm thinking I could just weld a cross brace between the frame rails and some brackets on the rear end and drop on a set of coil overs.

 

Thoughts?

[chillininnh 21]

I'm running Ron Morris' coil over kit up front and Global West lowering 5 leafs with Del-A-Lum bushings and Koni classics set to full soft in the back and the ride is firm but never jarring. Front shocks are QA-1 single adjustable set 6 clicks from full soft and the springs are 475lb. I love how the car goes down the road and let me tell you, the roads in central NH are NOT smooth. 18K miles in 3 cruising seasons! What's ruining your ride is the cut front springs IMO.

[MikeStang 247]

When I say cut. I only removed MAYBE 1/2 a coil..... 4" to 4-1/2" from the bottom of the coil and that's it...

Dont know if that would affect ride that much.... It feels good in the front end but the back end is a bit jaring

[Powershift 19]

Without a doubt, your solution to better ride quality is a front coil-over setup.

 

Coil springs can't compare with the adjustability, and spring rate selection, of a coil-over setup.

[SM69Mach 68]

Mike

 

I had the same issue. I switched to SoT coil over set up with the street valved Bilstein shocks and matching rear shocks and it has been a night and day difference. My old set up was 620 springs (not cut) and KYB shocks, and I felt like I was going to loose a filling every time I hit a good bump in the road. With the new set up, I have yet to have that experience. My car is slightly high now, but I raised it to get a bit more ground clearance.