To coyote or not to coyote?

[68turbostang 10]

Thinking about doing the coyote motor swap in my 70 mach 1. If you have done this swap, would you do it again, why or why not?

[rwcstang 201]

if you have the time and funds, I say do it. who is going to say no to a 400hp motor that gets 25mpg? lol

 

it'll be a hella alot more reliable then our motors.

[jandj1970 13]

Like rwcstang said time and funds, i looked at doing the coyote into my 70 mach1. To much money for me and i dont like some of the suspension kits out their for the conversion.

[rwcstang 201]

like wise, I wanted to do the same but I was looking at 12k+ for the conversion..

[Max Power 74]

Unlike LS swaps that fit like a glove in old GM chassis, the Coyote requires Boss 4296 clearances and lots of electronics for little HP gain. You can get a pushrod 5.0 to 425hp pretty easily. I think that is why you don't see it very often.

 

If I am gonna hog out my engine bay and spend 12k, I am putting a Kaase Boss 429 in there.

[cobra3073 24]

I tell you, THAT makes my brain hurt just thinking about it. Why did you put that thought in my head?

 

It WOULD definitely be a positive approach but being a BIG block fan, I would probably rather do as "Max Power" stated --go with some version of the 429/460.

 

GREAT topic!

 

 

BT

[70Mach03 12]

Unlike LS swaps that fit like a glove in old GM chassis, the Coyote requires Boss 4296 clearances and lots of electronics for little HP gain. You can get a pushrod 5.0 to 425hp pretty easily. I think that is why you don't see it very often.

 

If I am gonna hog out my engine bay and spend 12k, I am putting a Kaase Boss 429 in there.

 

 

X's 3

[68turbostang 10]

This is going to be a daily driver car so I'm not just going for max power, the coyote will give me the power I'm looking for and I can always throw on a supercharger or turbo if I want a little more. I am looking for gas mileage, reliability and drivability.

[MustangChuck 16]

If I am gonna hog out my engine bay and spend 12k, I am putting a Kaase Boss 429 in there.

 

:drool: !!! My thinking exactly!

 

And on that topic, Kaase has new SFB heads that will get you to/over that 650 HP level. Just something to think about.

 

Chuck

[Steve69 0]

I was thinking of the same thing. I do have a Coil over suspension currently but even trimming the shock towers I still dont think there is going to be enough room. I think unless I win the Lotto Im going 5.0 or stroker and some type of EFI.

 

Steve69

[samwe 0]

I am working on this... I bought a used truck motor though. I need to swap intake cams and front cover, then it should be the same as the car motor.

I got a low mileage 4R75E to put behind it. I already had MII suspension.

[RPM 1,190]

And if you go the Kaase route, you don't need super or turbo chargers. Try to show me a cooler motor than a Boss 9.

 

Bob

[Max Power 74]

This is going to be a daily driver car so I'm not just going for max power, the coyote will give me the power I'm looking for and I can always throw on a supercharger or turbo if I want a little more. I am looking for gas mileage, reliability and drivability.

 

You can achieve a lot of those goals using a pushrod EFI 5.0 with a decent HCI package.

[68turbostang 10]

You can achieve a lot of those goals using a pushrod EFI 5.0 with a decent HCI package.

 

I know I can achieve the goals with a pushrod V8, but wouldn't the technology of the new coyote motor be even better in a daily driver?

[MustangChuck 16]

I personally don't believe so. A well tuned carb is just as good as EFI. With the right transmission and rear gears, you can get 25+ MPG (a T-5 with 3.08s and a light foot should get you close). And, as the engine ages, the carbed engine will be easier (and cheaper) to maintain. Granted, with the OBD-II setup, it may be easier to diagnose problems than the old ECC-IV systems found in the 87-95 Mustangs. But the cost of the sensors and other EFI parts are quite a bit more than a new carb every couple of years. (And, of course, cleaning and rebuilding one can be done for under $50.)

 

I am assuming your Mach I has a 351W. You could go EFI with the Kaase P-38 heads and a moderate cam. Back it up with a beefed up T-5 and mild (2.89 - 3.25) rear gears and you should get good results. (DISCLAIMER: JUST MY GUESS. NO PERSONAL EXPERIENCE.) No cutting on an original Mach I and will cost A LOT less than a Coyote swap.

 

Just my opinion.

Chuck

[68turbostang 10]

I would definitely use an efi setup, I want to get everything tuned in and forget about it. I don't want to keep messing with things even if it is only once every few years. I have never heard of anyone getting 25mpg with a carbed 351w. Not saying it isn't possible, but I have never heard of it being done.

[JTG 10]

I'm not at the point of putting in the motor but I like the idea of dropping in a coyote. I'm planning to put a MII suspension in so the option is open. If not a coyote then an aluminum mod motor would work. Mine won't be a daily driver but a newer fuel injected motor would be cool.

[Max Power 74]

I know I can achieve the goals with a pushrod V8, but wouldn't the technology of the new coyote motor be even better in a daily driver?

 

You could actually use a 87-95 5.0 set up with all the fuel injection and do just about as well. A lot less surgery.

 

I think the underlying theme seems to be here, and trust me, I don't want to talk you out of anything, but it seems you want a classic car without any of the nuances of owning a classic car.

 

While you could spend 10s of thousands trying to technology your way our of the classic car experience, to me that would be jumping over dollars to pick up dimes, and spending 15 grand to never have to fiddle with it seems like this whole idea is spinning out of control. You could buy a lot of mechanic for that.

 

To me a big part of the joy in owning a classic is the fact that they AREN'T laden with technology, they do provide something more than the vanilla efficiency of modern technology, and believe it or not, people managed to use these cars as daily drivers back in the day. It wasn't that big of a deal.

 

Entirely your call, but to me the amount you are spending (and fiddling) to avoid fiddling seems really over the top.

 

Just one man's opinion, FWIW.

[RogerC 136]

I would definitely use an efi setup, I want to get everything tuned in and forget about it. I don't want to keep messing with things even if it is only once every few years. I have never heard of anyone getting 25mpg with a carbed 351w. Not saying it isn't possible, but I have never heard of it being done.

Not a 351W but 351C. Last road trip I did from Ohio to NE Arkansas back in the mid 80s, I got 25mpg, ~500mi. That's with 70 351C 4V, close ratio 4 speed & 3.00:1 gears and just cruising. Kept my foot out of it. 2nd pic from right in my signature was taken right before the trip.

 

I drove my 79 daily for 9 years with only one major problem, warmed over 302 4V 5 speed ~3.50:1 gears (whatever standard 89 GT 8.8 gears are). Just recently had a major issue with my 06 at 99,600 miles, clogged cats - cost me for a y-pipe with cats, 4 oxygen sensors, & a muffler. Modern technology still goes bad like old technology.

 

I'm not at all trying to talk anyone into or out of anything, just providing my experience. My overall attitude is; good mileage is a nice benefit but I didn't buy mustangs for mileage (including the 06 I drive 70 miles a day to work & back home).

[TinMan 77]

My 69 has been in storage since '83. (I'm the second owner)... Got college to pay for an in about 2 years, she comes back to life..

 

Shock towers are going away... Kaase 9 sounds wonderful.. but I prefer corners to straight line..

 

I figured a crate engine would be way more than this..

 

http://www.americanmuscle.com/coyote-crate-engine.html

 

I like that idea a lot... My daily is a 06 GT with just the 3V.. rocking the 69 with 50% more ponies and probably 600-700lb less weight sounds like a recipe for major fun..

[turboclevor 10]

i would rather spend 12k and put in a coyote that spend 20k on a kaase racing engine for street use and if it is a race car i would spend 20k and still put in a coyote, but with a 4.0l whipple

[BigDuke6 17]

If this could drop in without too much trouble, it would kick all forms of a$$

 

http://www.edelbrock.com/automotive_new/mc/crate_engines/ford_5.0-coyote.shtml

[mustangmike6996 34]

i would go the route of the coyote... its so much cooler. granted. i love a 429 boss... but the new 5.0 is a technical masterpiece.

[signal20gsxr 10]

Just my 2 cents. The mod motors are big and heavy. I know the Coyote has an aluminum block so its a little lighter. It makes good HP and torque but the old 302 with EFI and H,C,I, can make the same numbers and if tuned properly can get the same mileage and be just as reliable from my experience. I have seen 5.0 Fox bodies go 200,000 miles easily. I got 18 in town and 27 hwy mileage with my 87 GT. With that being said. Putting a Coyote motor in would definitely have a cool factor. Not as much as a Kaase Boss9 IMO though.

 

Bottom line- Its your money. Do what you want. I am sure no one is going to think its not cool.

 

FWIW, I have been out of loop for a little while but when the crate motors came out with the control package people were having annoying driveability issues with them. Don't know if they got this figured out yet or not. Ford was blaming it on the air intake. It has to be their inlet and air box. Which I think is garbage. I do not know if there is even room for this or not in an older stang. Turners have no problems with them in the current mustangs but the control pack that Ford offers has/had a glitch someplace.

 

What I don't like about these motors for a swap is that you can not control them with an aftermarket EFI system or tune it yourself like some OBD-II systems if your wanting to keep the Ti-VCT. So you are at the mercy of a tuner to try and get things right or throw in a set of aftermarket cams and lock them in place. Which IMO defeats the purpose and you will not get the same flat torque curve or mileage.

[redmach69 10]

How about leaving it alone and let it be what it is suppose to be. If you want a coyote engine because it is, as one person said a technical masterpiece, buy a 2013 GT. Don't attack me it's just another outlook.