ALL OF YA'LL!! could use some input on my dillemma

[Wisquared 10]

So I'm in a quandry on what to do with my Mostly Stock 69 Mach 1 with 428cj... ya see, I kinda wanna finish this car, but its not number matching. its a c6 orig california car though, and real 428 cj. The motor has been cmpletely done with rebore, valves, rings rods, bearings the whole deal. But a very mild cam in it, street cam. Tranz totally redone, posi rear. Interior 90% done correctly.

 

Basically the car will never really be "CORRECT" because its non numbers matching. so in finishing the project, I am reluctant to make it totally "right" and put the exact nut and bolt to it. HOWEVER!!!!!! I feel weird about molesting this car into a resto mod, especailly cuz the factory 428cj with c6 tranz ain't that fast. Lets face it... 335hp and three speed auto? not too kewl, and hardly worth resto-modding. and its horrible to work on in the engine bay too.

 

here's a pic of her

 

What should I do? Thinking about either

1) friggin just molest it!

2) sell the motor and tranz and use the $$ for a rad crate motor set up?

3) sell the whole car as it sits and molest a non 428 car, something with less beginning value from scratch?

 

and if selling the 428cj, what do you think the motor and tranz is worth?

 

I'd love your input, and be brutally honest!

 

Brant

Edited April 5, 2011 by Wisquared

[ccobra70 10]

I always have thought about your same situation about mine as well, years back there was a article in a mustang magazine that answered my question. What is your long term goal with the car?? If your going to sell it in the near future or somewhere down the road I would not hack it up to bad if at all, if you have no plans on selling it and want it the way you like it by all means do what you want to it and sense it's already somewhat molested it wouln't be as bad. I am 36 have had my car sense I was 15 I don't ever say never but I have no plans to ever sell my car (my kids may after I die) and thats fine!! so I built it the way I like it pro-tour and love it every day I have time to get out and drive it!! hope that helps some

[jholmes217 65]

I have a original Cobra Jet car also. What I am doing is a resto-mod, but I am not making any changes that cannot be reversed easily. I just can't see or afford paying thousands of dollars on original smog equipment, exhaust mainifolds, and a cast iron intake manifold that will slow the car down. However, anything I remove that is original, I am keeping in case I need to sell or decide to go full resoration in the future.

[Fordrevhead 29]

Either sell the whole car or love it but please dont break it up!

[69gtcoupe 10]

Keep it and hack the hell out of it turn it into something you'll love give it to your kids so they can love it. If you don't have kids give it to one of us and we will. Jk

[DarkBuddha 107]

Well, you know what I think:

 

[DRASTiK 22]

Ask yourself if you bought that car as a museum piece, or to drive it? If it's always going to bother you that you 'hacked it up', then sell it and start with something of less value. If it's not going to linger in the back of your head for years to come, then change it however you see fit and enjoy it.

 

One of the things I love so much about having a plane jane 69 coupe, is that I don't have to worry about this guilt. I purposely looked for and purchased a project car coupe so that I wouldn't need to worry about robbing the world of an original, valuable and rare mustang. It was already butchered when i got it, so I'm building it my way.... period...

 

Hope this helps. I'd hate for you to end up with any regrets. It's an important decision.

Edited April 6, 2011 by DRASTiK

[68stang289 26]

I also have a non-original 428 SCJ in my 70 mach. Car was originally a 351 car that was swapped with the 428 SCJ back in the late 70's. My motor is ridiculously built and I'm running a 4 speed, but I have had no problem resto-modding the car. I, much like jholmes, have been doing mostly only mods that can be switched back easily (custom gauge "console" under the heater controls, engine bay smoothed and painted the custom color I painted the car, dual exhaust cut out valance, replaced with a darker strip of gray vinyl on the highback mach buckets that originally came from the factory, front and rear disc brakes, braided ss brake lines, etc). I guess it depends on how wild you were thinking of going with the restomod. I prefer the very subtle customizing that only true enthusiasts will recognize and appreciate. Why not start off with some of the smaller things that are easy to change back if you want to and then go from there?

[Pakrat 1,043]

I think I would like a little more clarity on what you consider "non numbers matching" first since this term really doesn't apply to the Mustang world in the literal sense unlike Corvettes and such. Is it simply a wrong driver door and tag, the 428 isn't the original 428 or do the inner fenders have the wrong stamping or what. Some of these things are fixable and arguable to matching where others are not and that can make a difference in a cars worth or value as rare and collectable or not.

[Fordrevhead 29]

One of the things I love so much about having a plane jane 69 coupe, is that I don't have to worry about this guilt. I purposely looked for and purchased a project car coupe so that I wouldn't need to worry about robbing the world of an original, valuable and rare mustang. It was already butchered when i got it, so I'm building it my way.... period... quote]

 

Well said! That's what I did as well! I stopped looking for numbers, models, engines, years and looked for a solid stocker. Now I can do whatever I want guilt free. Just my 2cents

[68stang289 26]

I think I would like a little more clarity on what you consider "non numbers matching" first since this term really doesn't apply to the Mustang world in the literal sense unlike Corvettes and such.

 

Didn't they start stamping partial VIN's on the motors in 69 or 70 though? I know my 69 SCJ motor has the partial VIN stamped onto the block. I don't think that the term applies to 64 1/2-68 cars, but I do think it applies to 69 or 70 (whenever they started stamping the partial VIN's) and beyond.

[Pakrat 1,043]

I am actually not sure if they did it to all blocks or at all plants though and if that is the case then how could you say if the date code matched that it was or wasn't the original. My Mexican 302 has the consecutive unit number stamped on the block behind the intake manifold from the San Jose plant, that much I know for sure. Many I have seen though are sometimes not even legible.

[rmarks 20]

Didn't they start stamping partial VIN's on the motors in 69 or 70 though? I know my 69 SCJ motor has the partial VIN stamped onto the block. I don't think that the term applies to 64 1/2-68 cars, but I do think it applies to 69 or 70 (whenever they started stamping the partial VIN's) and beyond.

 

Actually K-code engines (not all...see HiPo site for debate on this) back in 1964 1/2 had partial VINs (my previous 64 1/2 & 66 K-codes had them).

 

My San Jose '69 has a partial VIN, but as others have stated, numbers-matching for Mustangs applies more to date coding.

[Wisquared 10]

well as far as I know, "numbers matching" meant that the original drive train was in the car? right?

 

Mine was built as a 351w car, and in 71, the orig owner had some kinda issue, installed the 428cj back then... thats all I meant by non numbers matching

[stangs-R-me 120]

You had us all believing this was an original 428 CJ car that currently has a 428 CJ in it just not it's original engine.

 

Now that you are saying it is an original 351W car, that changes everything. Now were talking more or less a base model Mach 1 which is no where near as rare as a 428 CJ Mach 1. Ford probably built more '69 351W Mach 1's than they did plain sportsroofs with a 351W.

 

I consider any '69 Mach 1 as being desireable, but a common base 351W car is nothing you should be concerned about keeping it 100% original for it's collectability.

 

To the right person, the 428 CJ drivetrain is worth more out of your car than in it. If you can find someone interested in paying what it's worth, I'd sell the drivetrain and build up a stealthy 351W based 427.

 

Doug

[Pakrat 1,043]

Yeah I was given that impression as well initially, that's exactly why I wanted it clarified before giving an opinion. I agree that the 428 is likely worth more to someone else than it is to you, in fact there was recently a posting for an original 428 car missing the drivetrain. I would get the date codes off it and consider selling, it wouldn't last long, the right person is probably out there already looking and just waiting in the shadows for someone like you to come along.

 

Modify your car guilt free and a stroked 351W power plant would be a great choice.

[SM69Mach 68]

Yeah I was given that impression as well initially, that's exactly why I wanted it clarified before giving an opinion. I agree that the 428 is likely worth more to someone else than it is to you, in fact there was recently a posting for an original 428 car missing the drivetrain. I would get the date codes off it and consider selling, it wouldn't last long, the right person is probably out there already looking and just waiting in the shadows for someone like you to come along.

 

Modify your car guilt free and a stroked 351W power plant would be a great choice.

 

 

+1 Agree withthis 100%

[68stang289 26]

I agree that the 428 is likely worth more to someone else than it is to you, in fact there was recently a posting for an original 428 car missing the drivetrain. I would get the date codes off it and consider selling, it wouldn't last long, the right person is probably out there already looking and just waiting in the shadows for someone like you to come along.

 

It depends what that 428 is out of though and if it is in fact a CJ vs. a PI or regular ol' 428 out of say a Thunderbird. They also had 428 CJ's in other Ford cars (Fairlanes, Torinos, Cyclones, and Cougars all come to mind) and a lot of times those guys are willing to pay considerably less because the cars don't sell for as much.

 

Wisquared, what have you done to verify that what you have is in fact a CJ motor and not a PI or regular 428?

[Wisquared 10]

68stang289- well I'm so friggin green on all this, I have no idea how to verify all that.... I was told by a good friend who builds customs all day that this is indeed a 428, but not sure from where it actually came... I bought the car in 1995, and is was turd polished really well. since then I've been "un-fucking" this car ever since.

 

I wounldn't be surprised if this thing erally isn't too special, but honesly, even though i realized there were several different 428 versions, I don't know what the difference was in them all.

 

how do I check?

[DarkBuddha 107]

First thing, post the first 5 digits of the VIN. That will tell us if the car is supposed to have a 428 from the factory (or not). If it was, that is important from a collector's standpoint. If not, that just means someone put a 428 (or other FE?) of yet-to-be-determined lineage in the car. Depending on the motor itself, it may or may not be worthy of collector concern.

[afret 37]

I would turn it into something like this and have fun with it: :smile:

 

 

 

 

Edited April 10, 2011 by afret

[stangme428 33]

please tell me you can send me some hi-res digital photos of the two 69's leaving the line. this has to be one of my favorite photos of all time!!! awesome shot and i bet it was an awesome ride!!! and yes the cobra jet leaving the line looks great too!!

[afret 37]

Don't mean to hijack the thread but here's another angle:

 

 

A few more of Don Keen's C/S car and my white one:

 

 

 

 

 

 

These cars are doing what they were meant to do. :biggrin:

 

If you post your email address I could send you a higher res version of the first photo.

[Wisquared 10]

without even looking at the vin, Im positive it was an original 351 car

[LoneWolf2U 136]

So its an H code with a 428 in it now.

Check the block for casting #'s on the block to see what it came from and build the car like you want it. :biggrin: