I have an idea I need some technical brainstorming on.....

[Pakrat 1,043]

OK so here's something that has been kicking around in my head for a while and I'd like to get some ideas from you guys, particularly you scratch builders so I can keep my eyes open for parts. My car when on the road really doesn't see a lot of night time driving and I am plenty happy with my quite inexpensive and stock headlights as opposed to upgrading them to modern specs and wiring. I would much rather spend some money on some small driving lights I could set in where the front license plate goes. I've seen it on a few cars now and not only would it suit my purpose but I'm really starting to like the look, it's pretty cool and slightly custom and not looking out of place or busy.

 

So now comes the dilema to work around, I live in a state that requires the use of a front license plate and it has to be bumper mounted, you can't just leave it on your dashboard or anything. So I got to thinking, what if I put togehter a little actuator or motor that would work like a pop up headlight does, the lights could hide behind the plate and when needed just flip the switch and you are good to go, the best of both worlds and a neat little custom ap as well.

 

I'm just not sure how to go about it, what to look for. Is there something new or used differently than from headlight but the same fashion that would work better or do I just start putting a list of cars with pop up headlights together and start calling salvage yards? I know they make kits to remove pop ups from cars with them and install a regular lens so maybe they can be had used for cheap on some other type of forum or maybe I am over complicating it and there is a simple electric hinge of some sorts that I don't know about it.

 

Any thoughts or ideas are welcome to help me brainstormn and think it through more from just a concept to a reality.

 

 

[Pakrat 1,043]

I found this list online of cars that had pop ups on it, don't know how complete it is but it is a bigger list than I imagined. I guess something more period correct would be the easiet to adapt and intigrate like say from a late 60's Camaro or T-Bird but I'm guessing the parts are expensive if even available. I'm sure new aprts like for a vette can be had but again probably not cheap. I remeber an old Nissan Pulsar I had had them and they had an override switch that just opened them without putting them on, that would be handy.

 

 

 

List of cars with hidden or pop-up headlights

• Acura/Honda Integra, 1986–1989
  
• Acura/Honda NSX, 1990–2001
  
• Alfa Romeo Montreal, 1970–1977
  
• Alpine GTA, 1987 (U.S. spec)
  
• Alpine A610, 1991–1995
  
• Aston Martin Lagonda, 1976–1989
  
• Aston Martin Vantage Zagato Volante, 1986–1989
  
• Aston Martin Bulldog, 1980 (concept car)
  
• Asüna Sunfire, 1993
  
• Bitter CD, 1973
  
• Bitter SC, 1979
  
• Bricklin SV-1, 1974–1976
  
• Brooke RR, 1995–
  
• BMW 8 Series, 1989–1999
  
• BMW GINA, 2008 (concept car)
  
• BMW M1, 1978–1981
  
• Buick Reatta, 1988–1991
  
• Buick Riviera, 1965–1969
  
• Buick SkyHawk, 1982–1988
  
• Buick Y-Job, 1938 (concept car)
  
• Cadillac Eldorado, 1967–1968
  
• Chevrolet Camaro, 1967–1969 (optional)
  
• Chevrolet Caprice, 1968–1969 (optional and very rare)
  
• Chevrolet Corvette, 1963–2004
  
• Chrysler 300, 1968–1971
  
• Chrysler Imperial, 1969–1993
  
• Chrysler LeBaron, 1987–1992 (coupe & convertible only)
  
• Chrysler New Yorker Fifth Avenue, 1990–1993
  
• Chrysler New Yorker, 1976–1981 and 1988–1993
  
• Cizeta-Moroder V16T, 1991–2003
  
• DeSoto, 1942
  
• De Tomaso Mangusta, 1970–1971 (US-spec)
  
• De Tomaso Pantera, 1971–1974
  
• De Tomaso Guarà, 1993–2004
  
• Dodge Charger, 1966–1970, (optional in 1971 & 1972)
  
• Dodge Charger Daytona, 1969–1970
  
• Dodge Daytona, 1987–1991
  
• Dodge Magnum, 1978–1979 (clear covers)
  
• Dodge Monaco, 1972–1973
  
• Dodge Royal Monaco, 1976–1978
  
• Dodge Stealth, 1991–1993
  
• Dodge St. Regis, 1979–1981 (clear covers)
  
• Eagle Talon, 1990–1991
  
• Ferrari 288 GTO, 1984–1985
  
• Ferrari 308 GTB, 1975–1984
  
• Ferrari 328, 1985–1989
  
• Ferrari 348, 1989–1995
  
• Ferrari 365 California Spyder, 1966–1967
  
• Ferrari F355, 1994–1999
  
• Ferrari F40, 1987–1992
  
• Ferrari 400/412, 1976–1989
  
• Ferrari 456/456M, 1992–2003
  
• Ferrari Berlinetta Boxer, 1973–1984
  
• Ferrari 365 GTB/4 & GTS/4 "Daytona", 365 GTC/4, 365 GT4 2+2, 1970–1976
  
• Ferrari GT4, 1974–1980
  
• Ferrari Mondial, 1980–1995
  
• Ferrari Testarossa, 512TR, 1984–1994
  
• Fiat X1/9, 1973–1988 (also called Bertone X1/9 in the USA)
  
• Ford Galaxie 500 XL, 1968–1970
  
• Ford LTD, 1968–1970 (including Country Squire wagon)
  
• Ford LTD Landau, 1975–1978 (including Country Squire wagon)
  
• Ford Probe, 1989–1997
  
• Ford Ranchero, 1970 (GT only)
  
• Ford Thunderbird, 1967–1969 and 1977–1982
  
• Ford Torino Brougham, 1970
  
• Geo Storm, 1991
  
• Ginetta Dare DZ, 1998
  
• Honda Accord, 1986–1989
  
• Honda Integra, 1986–1989
  
• Honda NSX; 1990–2001
  
• Honda Prelude, 1983–1991
  
• Imperial, 1969–1975 and 1981–1983
  
• Isuzu Piazza, 1981–1987 (also Isuzu Impulse, Holden Piazza)
  
• Jaguar XJ220, 1992–1994
  
• Lamborghini Athon, 1980 (concept car)
  
• Lamborghini Bravo, 1974 (concept car)
  
• Lamborghini Countach, 1974–1990
  
• Lamborghini Diablo, 1990–1998
  

[Pakrat 1,043]

Part II, the list was too long to post apparantly.

 

• Lamborghini Islero, 1968–1969
  
• Lamborghini Jalpa, 1981–1988
  
• Lamborghini Jarama, 1970–1976
  
• Lamborghini Urraco, 1973–1979
  
• Lamborghini Marco Polo, 1982 (concept car)
  
• Lamborghini Miura, 1966–1973
  
• Lamborghini Silhouette, 1976–1979
  
• Lancia Montecarlo, 1975–1979 (for Scorpion, North-American version)
  
• Lancia Stratos, 1972–1973
  
• Lincoln Continental, 1970–1981
  
• Lincoln Mark series, 1968–1983
  
• Lister Storm, 1993–1999
  
• Lotus Eclat, 1974–1982
  
• Lotus Elan, 1962–1973, Lotus Elan +2 1967–1975,
  
• Lotus Elan M100 1989–1995
  
• Lotus Elite, 1974–1982
  
• Lotus Esprit, 1976–2004
  
• Lotus Excel, 1982–1992
  
• Manta Mirage, 1974–1986
  
• Maserati Bora, 1971–1980
  
• Maserati Ghibli, 1966–1973
  
• Maserati Indy, 1969–1974
  
• Maserati Khamsin, 1974–1982
  
• Maserati Merak, 1972–1982
  
• Mazda 929 (some models)
  
• Mazda AZ-550 Sports Type A, 1989 (concept version)
  
• Mazda Familia Astina, 1989–1994
  
• Mazda MX-5 Miata, 1989–1997
  
• Mazda RX-7, 1978–2002
  
• Mercury Cougar, 1967–1970
  
• Mercury Capri, 1991–1994 (Third Generation)
  
• Mercury Marquis, 1969–1978
  
• Mercury Montego, 1970 (some models)
  
• Mitsubishi GTO/3000GT, 1991–1993
  
• Mitsubishi Eclipse, 1990–1991
  
• Mitsubishi Starion, 1982–1990 (also Dodge/Plymouth/Chrysler Conquest, captive imports)
  
• Monica 560, 1973–1974
  
• Nissan Silvia/200SX(S12), 1983–1989
  
• Nissan 180SX/200SX/240SX(S13), 1989–1994 [also 1996–1998 (Kouki) 180SX]
  
• Nissan 300ZX, (Z31), 1984–1989
  
• Nissan Pulsar/N12 NX/N13 NX/N13 EXA, 1983–1990
  
• Oldsmobile Toronado, 1966–1969 and 1986–1992
  
• Opel GT, 1968–1973
  
• Panther Solo, 1989–1990
  
• Plymouth Fury, 1970–1971 (Gran Coupe & Sport Fury, Sport Suburban wagon for 1971)
  
• Plymouth Fury III, 1972 (optional)
  
• Plymouth Laser, 1990–1991
  
• Plymouth Superbird, 1970
  
• Pontiac Fiero, 1984–1988
  
• Pontiac Firebird, 1982–2002
  
• Pontiac Grand Prix, 1967–1968
  
• Pontiac GTO, 1968–1969
  
• Pontiac Sunbird SE/GT 1986–1993
  
• Porsche 911 Turbo SE 'Slantnose', 1985–1989, 964 Turbo S 'Flatnose', 1994
  
• Porsche 914, 1969–1976
  
• Porsche 924, 1976–1988
  
• Porsche 928, 1978–1995
  
• Porsche 944, 1982–1991
  
• Porsche 968, 1991–1994
  
• Quantum Sports Cars 2+2, 1993–
  
• Saab Sonett III, 1970–1974
  
• Saturn SC2, 1991–1996
  
• Subaru XT 1985–1991
  
• Toyota 2000GT, 1967–1970
  
• Toyota Celica, 1982–1993
  
• Toyota Corolla, 1983–1991
  
• Toyota MR2, 1984–1999
  
• Toyota Sprinter Trueno, 1983–1992
  
• Toyota Supra, 1982–1992
  
• Triumph TR7/TR8, 1975–1982
  
• TVR Tasmin/280i/450 SEAC, 1981–1989
  
• Venturi Atlantique 300, 1987–1999[1]
  
• Volvo 480, 1986–1995
  
• Vector M12, 1995–1999
  
• Vector W8, 1989–1993
  
• Vector WX-3, 1993
  
• Zimmer Quicksilver, 1986–1989
  

[stangme428 33]

maybe use a modified arduino setup?

http://www.arduino.cc/cgi-bin/yabb2/YaBB.pl?num=1292431469

with a actuator or servo setup... james bond style...

 

lots of info and projects on the arduino forums..:thumbup1:

Edited February 3, 2011 by stangme428

[ruger1 10]

You may also check out www.mannsmotorsports.com the home of Fastags. Jared makes a setup for motorcycles that flips the licence plate down so it can't be read. Now I know it would be different on the front of a car but the principal should still be the same. The car type usually has a motor (too bulky) and a cross shaft run to both sides. Not to say you could modify one to work. It may be worth an email or call to him, being a small company, it may just be a new product for him to develope. If needed I can stop and see him.

[Jayru 17]

I'm pretty sure it's illegal to make any license plate remotely flip up out of view. The Authorities will argue you're using it to avoid detection from cameras, toll booths, etc.

 

It sounds silly but they will ticket you, or worse impound the car.

[Grabber70Mach 107]

Something that might interest you Pak

 

http://www.altecproducts.com/

 

http://www.mach1registry.org/forums/showthread.php?t=110650

[Fordrevhead 29]

There are a few systems out there that flip license plates. www.007numberplate.com is one in the UK, there are others.

 

Dont get them confused with the sport bike ones that are just a solenoid and a spring that stand the plate out 90 degree so it cant be read from behind.

 

Aside from the legal and aesthetic discussions here's my initial thoughts technically...

 

One could reverse engineer an existing system like above for starters. You may need more power, etc with the added weight of the lights. Then you would need to incorporate a powering system to the lights. You could use a commutator ring (dual actually) to run the power to the lights. This would have to basically be centered on the pivot point. Since they will be 12v lights the current to run decent lights is fairly high, which is not good for a commutator generally speaking. Not to mention that exposing commutator rings to the elements will reduce life. Not impossible but expensive and problematic (ie: you'd always be fooling with them.) Next choice would be contacts that disconnected when the lights folded in. Kind of backwards since you wouldnt want the contacts on the outside. You could put the contacts on the top side but now instead of the plate always flipping in the same direction your system might now have to know where it was and reverse direction every time it was selected. This could be done with a prox or logic switch (both which need at least a simple control, the second would also fail without an eprom if there was a loss of power). Not impossible just more complicated.

[MikeStang 247]

Wanna do it on the cheep, just go get 2 small servos from a hobby shop for an RC car, then wire them up to a flip switch.

You will need to get a liscense fram bracket and build a little hinge for it, then attach some of those radio hanger brackets to each servo and Voila....Pretty simple design really.

Or you could use a vac actuated servo so that any time you start the car the plate flips up.....Only down side is once it flips up the Wind is gonna reek havock on that plate and bracket, because the chin spoiler is gonna push air up under it toward the lower valance, maybe you could cut some cool designs in the plate to help negate some of the lift

You really wanna get fancy, make it so that it lifts and retracts...

Mike

[70stangcoupe 10]

What of instead of flipping the plate up you make the plate slide down. that way your plate is still visible. just need some guide rails on each side of the plate. and maybe use a door lock actuator to move the plate up and down.

[StephenC 10]

What about doing something like this

 

But have the fog lights mounted behind the flip down they might be a little recessed into the front valance but it looks like it could work. Also your license plate would fold all the way down not just half way. Just mount the two fog lights one on each side of the of the straight bar in the middle you could probably weld a bracket onto the bumper or maybe even the front stone defector to mount the unit.

Edited February 7, 2011 by StephenC

[Pakrat 1,043]

Thanks for the ideas guys, you got me thinking in some different directions now. That altec product that grabber posted would pretty much do the trick if I could mount it upside down instead to fit where the normal plate goes and hide under the bumper. I was initially thinking of it just rotating up on an arc like a door and not flipping than retracting but this makes it easier to install the lights since I never intended for them to be attached to the plate, they would be staionary mounted like the cars I posted just including a plate, not like an actual pop up headlight. This setup would make it easier for sure not having to reduce the size of the lights for the arc. I would prefer to run a seperate toggle for the lights anyway and with this kit you can claim it is installed for show use only to avoid any legal questions or issues. Summit seems to have it for $130 which I guess isn't too bad since I'd probably spend that in parts and trial and error and the manual one is at least $40 anyway. Hmmm, this may be the ticket, I'll have to see if I can track down someone who has one so I can inspect it more closely and take some measurements.