69 mach 408w build

[BuckeyeDemon 211]

i'm an electrical design engineer developing hi-rel electronics for satellites, launch vehicles, etc.

 

i have no formal training on the car stuff. however, i've been around it my whole life. so most of what i post are just my experiences. which in many cases i hope can help others in their projects by learning from the mistakes i make.

 

with the car in the current configuration, i don't plan on checking the additional angles any time soon. nor do i plan on moving the engine/transmission at all in the future. with the headers, clutch linkage and shaker, it would be a tremendous amount of work to alter later. i will check the angle once the car is built and sitting back on the wheels weighted down. then i will make the necessary pinion angle change.

 

that is one reason i wanted to try and keep the engine angle as close to original as possible because of the other two unknowns. the mods i did made a nominal 0.25 to 0.50 degree change. however the engine and transmission did drop at least 0.5" that also has an effect on the rest of the angles. i made an assumption (right or wrong) that the tailshaft sits just a little higher than the pinion. thus lowering would only have a positive effect on the working angle of the universal.

 

i only had to notch the floor support. the ron morris drops helped alot in my opinion.

 

consider a tko600 instead of the 500. i don't think the price difference was that much (in the big picture).

Edited March 13, 2010 by BuckeyeDemon

[Fordrevhead 29]

Gotcha, yeah the first gear on the 600 is inticing. We'll see how the budget looks come time. I would go with a Promotion Powershifter which is basically a privately labeled Steeda Triax.

[BuckeyeDemon 211]

i would have preferred a shifter with positive stops in the shifter itself instead of the transmission, but i couldn't find anything with those types of features and low profile. with the stock tremec shifter, i couldn't even get the boot to bolt down to the tunnel bracket.

 

revhead,

out of curiosity, what motor/rear gear are you using?

Edited March 13, 2010 by BuckeyeDemon

[Fordrevhead 29]

 

revhead,

out of curiosity, what motor/rear gear are you using?

 

A VERY stout built 289 from my drag car! I have a Ford 9" as well, but I haven't chosen gears yet. Someday I'd like to build a stroker as well; but not for this build.

[Trav_450R 10]

lookin good man!

 

i feel like an idiot for asking this, but how exactly do build a 408? do you use a a 351 Clevland block?

[BuckeyeDemon 211]

a 408 is simply a 4" stroke with a 4.030" bore. i'll be starting with a 351 windsor block

Edited March 13, 2010 by BuckeyeDemon

[BuckeyeDemon 211]

as mentioned, i have been working on trying to squeeze a shaker under the hood with the Victor Jr. intake and the 351W. here are a couple pictures. i still have to weld up the drop base to the shaker base and do some clean up work, add some clearance to the distributor, etc....

 

inside this is a 14" X 2.813" round filter. i think the stock was something like a 13.3 X 2.2?

 

because the base was originally for a 428CJ, i wanted to added the lip to make it look more like a 351W shaker base. So i had to raise the lip up a little. i formed a piece of 3/16" solid tube into a circle and welded this the entire way around the base. the midplate will rest against this.

 

i think cut a piece of 20 awg steel. folded the edge on once side and bent an angle on the other side, then used a shrinker/stretcher to form it into a circle. this detail consumed about 10 hours of work for me. i then welded it around the base.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited March 14, 2010 by BuckeyeDemon

[BuckeyeDemon 211]

i had to add more clearance to the shaker base for the distributor and wires.

 

i made a couple cuts so i could flex the original metal into the approximate shape for clearance

 

i used a shaping hammer on a shot bag in combination with a shrinker to shape a piece of steel

 

 

 

 

Edited March 13, 2010 by BuckeyeDemon

[Trav_450R 10]

hmm alright, does it matter if you use the windsor or clevland?

[BuckeyeDemon 211]

4" stroke cranks are available for windsors and clevelands.

Edited March 13, 2010 by BuckeyeDemon

[Trav_450R 10]

oh ok thanks

[BuckeyeDemon 211]

well, i can finally say that a shaker is going to fit with a victor jr.

 

this is aK&N 7/8" drop base. this is exactly the same as the 1 1/4" drop base with the only difference being the neck length. i'm using the 7/8" because i wanted to trim it down to the height I need.

 

i cut the entire neck off the drop base.

 

while mocking the shaker up, i determined the angle and neck length. i inserted the neck back thru the hole and tacked it into position. i had to dig for any space i could to make this thing fit. the victor jr. is a flat intake, thus the front of the air cleaner will want to rise in the air at an angle equal to the engine angle. by angling the air cleaner down, it allows more space in the shaker base.

 

i then trimmed the excess off the top and welded it shut. since i lowered and angled the base as much as possible, the front float adjuster interfered with the base. this was a fair trade because i probably picked up somewhere in excess of 1/2" of filter height.

 

here you can see the result drop and angle.

 

after a lot of work the shaker base has been trued up and is ready to get the air cleaner base into position.

 

after carefully aligning everything on the car, i made an L-shaped round piece of metal to attach the base to the air cleaner base. this was time consuming because the air cleaner base sits at an angle with the shaker base.

i made some little brackets to properly position the shaker base on the carburetor.

 

 

 

 

 

there is still a couple of things to clean up but it's 95% there.

Edited March 13, 2010 by BuckeyeDemon

[stangme428 33]

BuckeyeDemon --- great work!! gives me hope that i can add one at some point..... on my 408 Clevor setup!! cant wait to see your finished product..:biggrin:

 

keep up the good work.....:tongue_smilie:

[MikeStang 247]

Wow...Does the throttle linkage even hook up now that you have dropped the base down so much, I just noticed on the pass side you cant see hardly any of the carb lol.....You are doing some AWESOME WORK

Wish my welding skills were that good.

Mike

[Fordrevhead 29]

my guess is that he hasnt even looked at the linkage yet... that's probably next... now that he knows the hood will shut and seal. I am sure there's a way to make it work providing it even still has full travel under there, lol.

[BuckeyeDemon 211]

thanks for the positive feedback. the accelerator linkage was certainly one of the items to be addressed during this process. when i first posted on this site about doing this last year, i was expecting to have to cut a channel for the linkage. it turns out that everything worked out ok.

 

i've spent the last couple days cleaning up a few items with the shaker, radiator, linkage's, etc, before i pull everything back out and continue fitting up the fenders.

 

 

of course the original bracket didn't work with this mechanical carb. i had to bend it and make a new end to clear the accelerator pump.

 

there is quite a bit of clearance for the cable and bracket. i believe i had responded to moteaux a few weeks ago about doing a 1 1/4" drop base with the concern of the throttle linkage possibly interfering. without the angle i put in the base, the bracket would have come very close to hitting. if a person were to put an 1/8" bend in the bracket it would probably clear.

 

even at WOT there is plenty of clearance.

 

i had asked Pro-Systems when they built the carb if i could get the original holley finish because i'm trying to minimize how far i stray from looking original. they wouldn't do it. turns out like you have recognized, you can't see the carb anyways!

 

[maxum96 32]

WOW! Nice metal working. I don't know if I have enough metal working skills to try that. I would really love to have a shaker on my car since I'm doing a Boss 302 clone as far as the exterior of the car goes. I run a 351w stroker with a Victor Jr intake too. I used the Ron Morris dropped engine mounts. As you can see in my pictures I'm using a Mach 1 style scoop that's cutout underneath it with a Edelbrock oval air cleaner poking through the hood. But I'd love to have a shaker.

 

 

[BuckeyeDemon 211]

maxum, what gear are you running and are you happy with it? i can't decide between 3.89s and 4.11s.

Edited March 13, 2010 by BuckeyeDemon

[maxum96 32]

I've got 4.11's. With a 28" tall tire I'm running around 1800-2000 while doing 60mph. I love running a 5 speed. The first four gears are not too far apart. So if I want to play around i'm not winding out forever in a gear. Then when you hit the highway just put it in 5th. The car just cruises. But I've found the twisties can be a ball in this car with it lowered and the 5 speed.

 

Where did you get the mid plate and the shaker top? Is it a fiberglass top or the diecast one? Thanks.

Edited March 1, 2010 by maxum96

[DoctorMargaretL 10]

Wow thats seems really interesting. Thanks for sharing ...

[BuckeyeDemon 211]

Maxum,

thanks for the response. i'll probably go 4.11's. every couple weeks i change my mind for a few days and lean towards the 3.89s.

 

the shaker base, midplate, spacer and scoop (cast) are all original hardware.

the base was from a 428. if i were to do it again i would have sold the base and found something similar to carve up since it's not correct for a 351w anyways.

 

 

the supervisor....

 

finally got the cam. i really have no idea how this one will behave. just comparing the lobes on this cam to the originally designed solid flat tappet reveals substantially different lobes. yet, the generic specs are similar...

Edited March 2, 2010 by BuckeyeDemon

[maxum96 32]

Ah a roller cam! You're gonna like that. I love mine. I have Crane shaft mount rockers on my heads. Thanks for the info on the shaker. After seeing how you did your's i'm considering copying your idea of lowering the shaker. Maybe I'll get a base from the junkyard and star cutting it up and see where I can get with it. Funny thing is, I had a 1970 or so Ford air cleaner laying around from a F100 pickup I had. I chucked it thinking I'd never need it again after I sold the truck.

[BuckeyeDemon 211]

i would have went with a shafts too but i already had Dove 1.7s.

 

copy away with the shaker. just promise to learn from my mistakes. i ordered a 1/4" carb spacer. it sits a little lower than i wanted. basically i'm adding back what i shaved off the top of the intake. consider having the intake milled at a slight angle if you do go that route

Edited March 13, 2010 by BuckeyeDemon

[SELLERSRODSHOP 13]

excellent work!! the attention to detail is top notch.

 

if anyone is interested, i fabbed up a shaker assembly using a torino scoop & based it all on the original stock air cleaner can & can give details on the procedure.

[Fordrevhead 29]

I dont want to mess up this project thread, but I like the Torino scoop too, have a picture of that on a stang?