The vertues of originality

[grendi 16]

this threat is kind of funny.

it reminds me on the never ending discussions in the german and swiss mustang boards.

 

most guys there are purists that would only do stuff that could have been done back in 1969, except maybe putting in a 400hp 347 stroker with edelbrock everything and to be honest, i can't stand those guys.

 

personally i think everything goes as long as it can be built back without great effort: my rack and pinion (randalls) was installed without any drilling, cutting or welding and nothing can be changed faster on a car then rims.

so selling or throwing away original parts that have been replaced with restomod parts is not an option for me.

 

depending on the condition of the vehicle, i think other modifications are totally ok as well. better a pro-tourer or restomod then a pile of rust.

 

Edited April 15, 2009 by grendi

[coz 108]

Hey sorry for cranking it up a notch.... I just went through this "conversation" with an older guy at a car show 2 weeks ago. He was walking around with guy about 40 slamming all the non-original cars. All he talked abut is how these young guys (30s-40s year olds) have ruined all these old cars and they're idiots for spending time and money on them. He ranted about how if they weren't orginal then they weren't worth the time. Thing was the guy knew very little about any of the cars. When asked what he had, he replied - a corvair and a 77 Monte Carlo. He went on and on about how some day they would be worth so much more than what was at the show. I explained to him most don't care about costs - its a passion and skill. An laughed when he talked up his corvair.

 

Anyway, I projected that conversation into this one and for that I was wrong. To each his own and I do understand the reasoning for keeping it original but also recognize (as does everyone here) that resto-mod, customs and Pro-tour have a place in the hot rod world. BTW: That was the 1st show of the season and it had two Shelbys and the ZR1 there. I'm not a fan of the vette but the engine was cool and had a see through plexiglass hood so you could see the engine.

 

The reason why I dusted the Shelby so bad (little over an 1/8 mile of street roads) was he could not hook up. Otherwise, that is one bad ass car.

 

I do believe a lot of people have been taken in by Barrett Jackson and think their car is worth way more than what it will sell for.

Edited April 14, 2009 by coz

[coz 108]

Hey sorry for cranking it up a notch.... I just went through this "conversation" with an older guy at a car show 2 weeks ago. He was walking around with guy about 40 slamming all the non-original cars. All he talked abut is how these young guys (30s-40s year olds) have ruined all these old cars and they're idiots for spending time and money on them. He ranted about how if they weren't orginal then they weren't worth the time. Thing was the guy knew very little about any of the cars. When asked what he had, he replied - a corvair and a 77 Monte Carlo. He went on and on about how some day they would be worth so much more than what was at the show. I explained to him most don't care about costs - its a passion and skill. An laughed when he talked up his corvair.

 

Anyway, I projected that conversation into this one and for that I was wrong. To each his own and I do understand the reasoning for keeping it original but also recognize (as does everyone here) that resto-mod, customs and Pro-tour have a place in the hot rod world. BTW: That was the 1st show of the season and it had two Shelbys and the ZR1 there. I'm not a fan of the vette but the engine was cool and had a see through plexiglass hood so you could see the engine.

 

The reason why I dusted the Shelby so bad (little over an 1/8 mile of street roads) was he could not hook up. Otherwise, that is one bad ass car.

 

I do believe a lot of people have been taken in by Barrett Jackson and think their car is worth way more than what it will sell for.

Edited April 14, 2009 by coz

[SlimeGold 69 15]

Hey sorry for cranking it up a notch.... I just went through this "conversation" with an older guy at a car show 2 weeks ago. He was walking around with guy about 40 slamming all the non-original cars. All he talked abut is how these young guys (30s-40s year olds) have ruined all these old cars and they're idiots for spending time and money on them. He ranted about how if they weren't orginal then they weren't worth the time. Thing was the guy knew very little about any of the cars. When asked what he had, he replied - a corvair and a 77 Monte Carlo. He went on and on about how some day they would be worth so much more than what was at the show. I explained to him most don't care about costs - its a passion and skill. An laughed when he talked up his corvair.

 

 

That's funny. This is one of the things that chaps my ass and one of the reasons I stay away from car shows. There are plenty of people like this guy your talking about who for some reason want to put down other cars while ranting the "rare valuable POS 77 Monte i have" is worth way more than yours. They must have some kind of complex or something. That's not why I own a 69 Mustang, to be a show-off or just to say looky what I have, mine is worth more or to put anybody down. It's just a car I always wanted. So I just drive it, change what I like and stay away from the "car show experts" for the most part. For the guys that do the all original thing, I say thanks. I get to see what a new 69 Mustang looked like. I'm 35 and wasn't even born in 69. I could never afford or care for a totaly restored all original Boss 429 for example, but to be honest I would not want to live in fear of owning such a car and it getting a scratch, surface rust forming on bare metal etc. That's not my idea of fun but to some it's worth it. Just have fun with YOUR car...no matter if it's a original or a mod. That's what it's all about.

Edited April 14, 2009 by SlimeGold 69

[SlimeGold 69 15]

Hey sorry for cranking it up a notch.... I just went through this "conversation" with an older guy at a car show 2 weeks ago. He was walking around with guy about 40 slamming all the non-original cars. All he talked abut is how these young guys (30s-40s year olds) have ruined all these old cars and they're idiots for spending time and money on them. He ranted about how if they weren't orginal then they weren't worth the time. Thing was the guy knew very little about any of the cars. When asked what he had, he replied - a corvair and a 77 Monte Carlo. He went on and on about how some day they would be worth so much more than what was at the show. I explained to him most don't care about costs - its a passion and skill. An laughed when he talked up his corvair.

 

 

That's funny. This is one of the things that chaps my ass and one of the reasons I stay away from car shows. There are plenty of people like this guy your talking about who for some reason want to put down other cars while ranting the "rare valuable POS 77 Monte i have" is worth way more than yours. They must have some kind of complex or something. That's not why I own a 69 Mustang, to be a show-off or just to say looky what I have, mine is worth more or to put anybody down. It's just a car I always wanted. So I just drive it, change what I like and stay away from the "car show experts" for the most part. For the guys that do the all original thing, I say thanks. I get to see what a new 69 Mustang looked like. I'm 35 and wasn't even born in 69. I could never afford or care for a totaly restored all original Boss 429 for example, but to be honest I would not want to live in fear of owning such a car and it getting a scratch, surface rust forming on bare metal etc. That's not my idea of fun but to some it's worth it. Just have fun with YOUR car...no matter if it's a original or a mod. That's what it's all about.

Edited April 14, 2009 by SlimeGold 69

[Pakrat 1,043]

This is a discussion that is older than dirt and like any discussion with opposing sides be it religion or politics etc. there is no one or right way. It's not like modifiying cars is a new thing, just the term restomod is and the general acceptance of it finally in our generation of cars. Just 20 years ago it was taboo to even suggest it. If all the guys that grew up in the 50's drove around in stock 32' fords we very likely would not even have muscle cars to play with today, we'd all either be drooling over Pinto's or have no car hobby at all. They all have their place and reason for being, I don't like seeing a truly rare car modified any more than a concourse correct purist does but I also think it's a waste to spend that same amount of time, money and energy perfectly restoring a car that is about as rare as a fly on a cows ass. Value is a whole other subject and any car is worth exactly what someone is willing to pay for it or what they are willing to take to part with it. I'd love for someone to show me a factory perfect 65' V8 coupe that is selling for the same price these days as the same model reborn by Chip Foose. That doesn't mean in the long run that things won't change but right now in this snapshot that's the way it is.

 

When I became the third owner of my 42k mile truly rust free mostly all original california car I didn't even think of myself as the owner so much as the current care taker of a piece of history. Sure it wasn't the orignal color anymore and it had some mild bolt on engine goodies but otherwise litte had been done over the years and who was I to suddenly change that even if underneath it was a plain jane lime gold 3spd 302. I had my eye on other mods but didn't have the heart to do much. All that changed when a careless driver changed it for me. In my eyes when it got bent in half and left for dead it was never going to be original again no matter what I did or how much money I threw at it so I could either walk away and let it rest in peace or see it as a license to build what I wanted and that is exactly what I did. Pretty much all of it is bolt on and easily reversed and I did not sell off my parts to pay for the new, I kept them all and I built it to drive in comfort because even with it's life now saved the car would not be happy getting towed around or sitting in the garage most of the time, it was born to be on the road and that is where it belongs.

 

I am constantly thankful for museum quality cars that preserve history and I hope they are always around but no one is ever going to tell me that if I want something that handles other than original that I have to buy a new car and learn to like it instead of being able to enjoy the best of both worlds or that I shouldn't change out the seats so the bad back I am now stuck with for the rest of my life despite a year of therapy can actually tolerate being in the car and bring me pleasure. Life dealt me a hand and I am making the best of it, how can that possibly ever be wrong? I suppose if I lost my legs instead and really modded it up and made it handycap accessable and driveable instead that some purists would think it was a great and a wonderful thing but I'm sure there are others who would still shake their head and frown and tell me that I no longer had the right to own the car or be in the hobby if I couldn't find a way to enjoy it as the factory intended. That is not what the country that built this car is all about and if it wasn't for other countries like Taiwan who saw the need and made the parts that we needed to keep these cars going all these years none of would be having these discussions yet they still get shit on too and berated for doing it. You don't see Ford stepping up though do you, they made these cars with the intention of not lasting and would rather spend their energy sueing all the guys that care the most and kept it alive for useing the Mustang name instead.

 

It's a hobby, it is meant to enjoy, so what ever that is to you is what you should do and damn anyone that says otherwise.

[Pakrat 1,043]

This is a discussion that is older than dirt and like any discussion with opposing sides be it religion or politics etc. there is no one or right way. It's not like modifiying cars is a new thing, just the term restomod is and the general acceptance of it finally in our generation of cars. Just 20 years ago it was taboo to even suggest it. If all the guys that grew up in the 50's drove around in stock 32' fords we very likely would not even have muscle cars to play with today, we'd all either be drooling over Pinto's or have no car hobby at all. They all have their place and reason for being, I don't like seeing a truly rare car modified any more than a concourse correct purist does but I also think it's a waste to spend that same amount of time, money and energy perfectly restoring a car that is about as rare as a fly on a cows ass. Value is a whole other subject and any car is worth exactly what someone is willing to pay for it or what they are willing to take to part with it. I'd love for someone to show me a factory perfect 65' V8 coupe that is selling for the same price these days as the same model reborn by Chip Foose. That doesn't mean in the long run that things won't change but right now in this snapshot that's the way it is.

 

When I became the third owner of my 42k mile truly rust free mostly all original california car I didn't even think of myself as the owner so much as the current care taker of a piece of history. Sure it wasn't the orignal color anymore and it had some mild bolt on engine goodies but otherwise litte had been done over the years and who was I to suddenly change that even if underneath it was a plain jane lime gold 3spd 302. I had my eye on other mods but didn't have the heart to do much. All that changed when a careless driver changed it for me. In my eyes when it got bent in half and left for dead it was never going to be original again no matter what I did or how much money I threw at it so I could either walk away and let it rest in peace or see it as a license to build what I wanted and that is exactly what I did. Pretty much all of it is bolt on and easily reversed and I did not sell off my parts to pay for the new, I kept them all and I built it to drive in comfort because even with it's life now saved the car would not be happy getting towed around or sitting in the garage most of the time, it was born to be on the road and that is where it belongs.

 

I am constantly thankful for museum quality cars that preserve history and I hope they are always around but no one is ever going to tell me that if I want something that handles other than original that I have to buy a new car and learn to like it instead of being able to enjoy the best of both worlds or that I shouldn't change out the seats so the bad back I am now stuck with for the rest of my life despite a year of therapy can actually tolerate being in the car and bring me pleasure. Life dealt me a hand and I am making the best of it, how can that possibly ever be wrong? I suppose if I lost my legs instead and really modded it up and made it handycap accessable and driveable instead that some purists would think it was a great and a wonderful thing but I'm sure there are others who would still shake their head and frown and tell me that I no longer had the right to own the car or be in the hobby if I couldn't find a way to enjoy it as the factory intended. That is not what the country that built this car is all about and if it wasn't for other countries like Taiwan who saw the need and made the parts that we needed to keep these cars going all these years none of would be having these discussions yet they still get shit on too and berated for doing it. You don't see Ford stepping up though do you, they made these cars with the intention of not lasting and would rather spend their energy sueing all the guys that care the most and kept it alive for useing the Mustang name instead.

 

It's a hobby, it is meant to enjoy, so what ever that is to you is what you should do and damn anyone that says otherwise.

[S code 69 13]

All good replies, just like what looks good to a guy who modifies there are splits in what looks good to an originality restorer. a concours judge would tear my cars apart, I'm fine with that because that's not what I'm going for none of my cars are worth spending the extra $20,000 to go concours on.

 

They are our cars, we can whack them up, we can do aftermarket reversable modification, we can go concours or like me you can strive for a car that would pass by all but the most informed as all original. my Mach 1 is a true S code car with quite a few options, but it didn't have posi so I added it, it was Silver Jade but it will be Gulfstream Aqua in a week or two, it will also have 69 Shelby wheels in place of the original ones. this is where my investment side struggles with the what do I want side and most of the time I do what I want.

 

I'm not a purist, but I want a car that is purely a 1969 Mustang or 1970 Superbee whatever the case may be. I'm not judging anyone, but I would like to urge those with nicer and more desirable cars of all makes not to do something they'll regret down the road. we all change our ways as we get older and wish we hadn't done things. I'm 46 now and I screwed up some nice cars in my teens and 20's that I should have been slapped for , my guess is 20 years from now a lot of folks here will be saying the same thing.

[S code 69 13]

All good replies, just like what looks good to a guy who modifies there are splits in what looks good to an originality restorer. a concours judge would tear my cars apart, I'm fine with that because that's not what I'm going for none of my cars are worth spending the extra $20,000 to go concours on.

 

They are our cars, we can whack them up, we can do aftermarket reversable modification, we can go concours or like me you can strive for a car that would pass by all but the most informed as all original. my Mach 1 is a true S code car with quite a few options, but it didn't have posi so I added it, it was Silver Jade but it will be Gulfstream Aqua in a week or two, it will also have 69 Shelby wheels in place of the original ones. this is where my investment side struggles with the what do I want side and most of the time I do what I want.

 

I'm not a purist, but I want a car that is purely a 1969 Mustang or 1970 Superbee whatever the case may be. I'm not judging anyone, but I would like to urge those with nicer and more desirable cars of all makes not to do something they'll regret down the road. we all change our ways as we get older and wish we hadn't done things. I'm 46 now and I screwed up some nice cars in my teens and 20's that I should have been slapped for , my guess is 20 years from now a lot of folks here will be saying the same thing.

[Truck 12]

I would like to urge those with nicer and more desirable cars of all makes not to do something they'll regret down the road.

 

I would urge us all to do that with everything we drive. They are our cars, so you have to avoid doing some unreversible modifications...

 

 

And speaking of "going down the road". When it comes time for resale, the car will be judged by how it runs. Either it'll have the 1969 stock feel, or it will outrun everything but the modifieds today. Identifying your buyer is key. If you pull your powerplant, tho-you can't just turn it out to rust. You have to do something that will not say "I have the original in a box somewhere under a fine layer of red dust."

[Truck 12]

I would like to urge those with nicer and more desirable cars of all makes not to do something they'll regret down the road.

 

I would urge us all to do that with everything we drive. They are our cars, so you have to avoid doing some unreversible modifications...

 

 

And speaking of "going down the road". When it comes time for resale, the car will be judged by how it runs. Either it'll have the 1969 stock feel, or it will outrun everything but the modifieds today. Identifying your buyer is key. If you pull your powerplant, tho-you can't just turn it out to rust. You have to do something that will not say "I have the original in a box somewhere under a fine layer of red dust."

[B-Man 11]

I believe once it is my car it should be done to my liking. I may need a little more grunt undre the hood and a little more color in the interior or under the hood. If Ford had the technology they would have been putting overdrives and roller engines in the 69's. I'm just happy seeing all these great cars on the road and not rotting away or being crushed. Do what you want whether restore or modify just get them out there so we can see them.

[B-Man 11]

I believe once it is my car it should be done to my liking. I may need a little more grunt undre the hood and a little more color in the interior or under the hood. If Ford had the technology they would have been putting overdrives and roller engines in the 69's. I'm just happy seeing all these great cars on the road and not rotting away or being crushed. Do what you want whether restore or modify just get them out there so we can see them.

[Truck 12]

it should be done to my liking.

 

Yes, put at some point, you have to admit maybe your liking isn't everyone's that's where you sell. It does open possibilities when you can say, "I have the original if you don't like it."

 

If 100% of you mods are improvements, it'll sell in a heartbeat, and the new owner will say, "I wonder why they didn't build them like this at the factory."

[Truck 12]

it should be done to my liking.

 

Yes, put at some point, you have to admit maybe your liking isn't everyone's that's where you sell. It does open possibilities when you can say, "I have the original if you don't like it."

 

If 100% of you mods are improvements, it'll sell in a heartbeat, and the new owner will say, "I wonder why they didn't build them like this at the factory."

[mustangmaniac2 10]

I vote for original cars, here is my car.

http://www.mustangphotos.com/photopost/showphoto.php/photo/813/cat/500/ppuser/1398

http://www.mustangphotos.com/photopost/showphoto.php/photo/818/cat/500/ppuser/1398

http://www.mustangphotos.com/photopost/showphoto.php/photo/814/cat/500/ppuser/1398'>http://www.mushttp://www.mustangphotos.com/photopost/showphoto.php/photo/814/cat/500/ppuser/1398

http://www.mustangphotos.com/photopost/showphoto.php/photo/814/cat/500/ppuser/1398

 

http://www.mustangphotos.com/photopost/showphoto.php/photo/812/cat/500/ppuser/1398

http://www.mustangphotos.com/photopost/showphoto.php/photo/811/cat/500/ppuser/1398

[mustangmaniac2 10]

I vote for original cars, here is my car.

http://www.mustangphotos.com/photopost/showphoto.php/photo/813/cat/500/ppuser/1398

http://www.mustangphotos.com/photopost/showphoto.php/photo/818/cat/500/ppuser/1398

http://www.mustangphotos.com/photopost/showphoto.php/photo/814/cat/500/ppuser/1398'>http://www.mushttp://www.mustangphotos.com/photopost/showphoto.php/photo/814/cat/500/ppuser/1398

http://www.mustangphotos.com/photopost/showphoto.php/photo/814/cat/500/ppuser/1398

 

http://www.mustangphotos.com/photopost/showphoto.php/photo/812/cat/500/ppuser/1398

http://www.mustangphotos.com/photopost/showphoto.php/photo/811/cat/500/ppuser/1398

[dennyb68 11]

:2guns:After all these replys my 1st reply pretty much said it all.Do it the the way YOU want it and screw anyone that dislikes it because there will be plenty that love it...:gun_bandana::001_tt2:

[dennyb68 11]

:2guns:After all these replys my 1st reply pretty much said it all.Do it the the way YOU want it and screw anyone that dislikes it because there will be plenty that love it...:gun_bandana::001_tt2:

[ForceFed70 14]

Here's my point of view.

 

Is your car an investment, or something for you to enjoy?

 

If it's an investment: Make it stock, park it, and never drive it except to the odd show. Spend all your time bragging about your car (it's hidden in the Garage so nobody would know if you don't brag it up) and make fun of people who do modify their cars.

 

If it's something you've bought for your own enjoyment: Do whatever you'd like and don't look back. Who is this car for... you or someone else? Drive it, enjoy it, and ask the "stock is best" guys where their cars are.

 

Personally, I've come to the conclusion that I'm never going to sell my car. So why worry about resale value?

 

I do agree tho with a couple of points mentioned earlier:

- Try to avoid modifying the rare classics.

- Keep the mods tasteful. A classy modification will still be cool in 20 years. 22's, a huge wing, and spaceship-like colored lights won't.

Edited April 15, 2009 by ForceFed70

[ForceFed70 14]

Here's my point of view.

 

Is your car an investment, or something for you to enjoy?

 

If it's an investment: Make it stock, park it, and never drive it except to the odd show. Spend all your time bragging about your car (it's hidden in the Garage so nobody would know if you don't brag it up) and make fun of people who do modify their cars.

 

If it's something you've bought for your own enjoyment: Do whatever you'd like and don't look back. Who is this car for... you or someone else? Drive it, enjoy it, and ask the "stock is best" guys where their cars are.

 

Personally, I've come to the conclusion that I'm never going to sell my car. So why worry about resale value?

 

I do agree tho with a couple of points mentioned earlier:

- Try to avoid modifying the rare classics.

- Keep the mods tasteful. A classy modification will still be cool in 20 years. 22's, a huge wing, and spaceship-like colored lights won't.

Edited April 15, 2009 by ForceFed70

[S code 69 13]

Mustangmaniac2, I love it, what you've done is where I'm headed. the spoilers and wheels are the way to go even if they are for a '70, I'm doing the same thing.

 

Very sweet, that car is like money in the bank you can wax and drive.

[S code 69 13]

Mustangmaniac2, I love it, what you've done is where I'm headed. the spoilers and wheels are the way to go even if they are for a '70, I'm doing the same thing.

 

Very sweet, that car is like money in the bank you can wax and drive.

[mustangmaniac2 10]

I do have the correct rims, I think the magnums it gives just a little more:thumbup1:, magnums were on a 69 Boss.

[mustangmaniac2 10]

I do have the correct rims, I think the magnums it gives just a little more:thumbup1:, magnums were on a 69 Boss.