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potato

Is a bone stock 429 an upgrade to a mildly built small block?

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I've got the 69 mustang coupe, nothing special, out in the driveway.  Previous owner put a 302 in place of the inline 6.  There's nothing wrong with the 302 thats in it, that I know of.

Problem is, I've got a 69 tbird sitting out in the driveway with the 429 thunderjet.  Under the hood, it looks almost bone stock.  This is pretty much the basic plain Jane 429.  I keep hearing something from the driveway calling me to yank this puppy out and drop it in the mustang.  It sounds like Tim the toolman Taylor's voice whispering "no replacement...  for.....  displacement".

Does the 429 in this form have anything over a stock 302 or 351w with an intake and headers on it?  And is it enough to make you want to snatch the motor out and shoehorn it into the mustang?  

Is there any cool factor to having the '69 429 in the car?  Or would you just stick with the small block and maybe jazz it up?

 

 

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There's no replacement for displacement, that's true. But remember, if the car was originally a straight six, it's probably not equipped to just drop in a big V8. Do your due diligence on brakes, suspension, differential, etc... you probably have 4 lug wheels and small drum brakes and other stuff that will require an upgrade. But have fun.

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All 69s came with 5 bolt lugs, but ya, the rest of the drive line will need to be stout. Since there's no replacement for displacement, and a 460 is the same size dimensionally as the 429, and you can stroke a 460 to 557... you see where I'm going here. 

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You can get a crate engine from Ford that is a stroked 351 in 427 or 460, with a warranty, and it'll fit a whole lot better than a 429 that bounces off the shock towers:

https://performanceparts.ford.com/engines/#351

In any event, you'll be needing a 9" rear end, and that sure didn't come with a 6.

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Yeah, this car's probably not gonna get a $15k+ motor in it.  Not unless somebody comes knocking on the door letting me know my long lost rich uncle has died.

The realistic options for this car are either the stock 429 out in the driveway or some windor motor that costs me around the same.  I figure pulling the 429 to use here will cost me about $5k by turning my complete running tbird i could sell into a roller.  Prices at the local engine shop for a complete dyno tested windsor with a warranty is $5k for 325hp and $6k for 400hp.  With a windsor, i can reuse my existing headers and engine accessories.

The front of the car is already swapped to granada disc brakes and the back has a complete 96 mustang axle with 3.55 gears and disc brakes.  Transmission is a curently T5 which would probably get replaced with a tremec if i got too much more torque under the hood.

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On 5/4/2022 at 10:52 AM, RPM said:

All 69s came with 5 bolt lugs, but ya, the rest of the drive line will need to be stout. Since there's no replacement for displacement, and a 460 is the same size dimensionally as the 429, and you can stroke a 460 to 557... you see where I'm going here. 

It is a fact that the 250 Six came with the same brakes, 5-Lug Wheels etc. as the 302 cars did. 

However, the base 200 Six in 1969-70 DID still come with 4-Lug wheels and smaller brakes etc. like the '65-68 Six cars did.

Doug

 

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6 hours ago, stangs-R-me said:

It is a fact that the 250 Six came with the same brakes, 5-Lug Wheels etc. as the 302 cars did. 

However, the base 200 Six in 1969-70 DID still come with 4-Lug wheels and smaller brakes etc. like the '65-68 Six cars did.

Doug

 

I think front disc option regardless of engine got 5 lugs.  My T code (200 cuin 6) 1970 with front discs has 5 lugs.

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My T code 1970 Grande had non-power front discs and 5 lugs, I added a Fiat brake booster to make it power. But the car is a T5 (not Mustang), so export cars might have been different.

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2 hours ago, aslanefe said:

My T code 1970 Grande had non-power front discs and 5 lugs, I added a Fiat brake booster to make it power. But the car is a T5 (not Mustang), so export cars might have been different.

That has got to be it ... T5 cars had many heavy duty upgrades standard so I can see 5-Lug Wheels / Disc Brakes being one.   Most T5's were pretty well optioned out too, so having a 200 Six in one has got to be pretty rare !!

Doug 

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12 minutes ago, EastYorkStang said:

Whats is wrong with the T bird ? I'd be more inclined to get that mobile.

The tbird is in pretty decent shape.  It just turns out its a little too nice and "rare" for me.  It has so many options.  On paper, it checks a lot of cool boxes.  In reality, its a lot more to maintain and a lot of parts that are hard to find replacements for.  50yr old switches and relays that you can't easily replace. Arm rests on the doors crack and new ones run $350 per side.  I'd rather have the mustang that has better aftermarket support.

The tbird is a cool cruiser.  Very smooth ride and super yuuuuuge trunk.  I just want something more roudy and raw.

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On 5/10/2022 at 7:19 AM, potato said:

The tbird is in pretty decent shape.  It just turns out its a little too nice and "rare" for me.  It has so many options.  On paper, it checks a lot of cool boxes.  In reality, its a lot more to maintain and a lot of parts that are hard to find replacements for.  50yr old switches and relays that you can't easily replace. Arm rests on the doors crack and new ones run $350 per side.  I'd rather have the mustang that has better aftermarket support.

The tbird is a cool cruiser.  Very smooth ride and super yuuuuuge trunk.  I just want something more roudy and raw.

Realise the value in the T-Bird and put a Windsor into the Mustang.  You can keep the T5 in it, its a DIY engine swap and changing the plugs will be a whole less pain.

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On 5/9/2022 at 5:19 PM, potato said:

The tbird is in pretty decent shape.  It just turns out its a little too nice and "rare" for me.  It has so many options.  On paper, it checks a lot of cool boxes.  In reality, its a lot more to maintain and a lot of parts that are hard to find replacements for.  50yr old switches and relays that you can't easily replace. Arm rests on the doors crack and new ones run $350 per side.  I'd rather have the mustang that has better aftermarket support.

The tbird is a cool cruiser.  Very smooth ride and super yuuuuuge trunk.  I just want something more roudy and raw.

Leave it as is and drive it.

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Back in the 1980's a buddy of mine dropped a stock 460 into a 1970 Mach 1 Q code 4 speed. His car was missing the 428CJ.  The car was not that fast.  Spark plug changes were not fun.  Even though it was already a big block car, he had to do a lot of changes to get the 385 series (429/460) engine to work in the car.  I almost dropped a stock 429 into a previous 70 Sportsroof I had back in the 1980's.  I ended up putting a mildly built 351C in my car instead.  I'm glad I didn't put the 429 in the car. 

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There's no replacement for displacement.... and the torque of a big block will make the front of your shorts stick out.

I had a 429/C6/9" in an Aussie Falcon years ago. Touched the towers, sucked gas but did it all with ease. With 2.75 rear it lit them up from a standing start in 2nd gear. But, unless you know what you are looking at most people won't realise it's not a Cleveland and so the cool factor is missing.

For $6K I'd go with a 351 Windsor based motor, keep all the current hardware and swap it in on a Saturday.

 

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